Wind turbines?

[sqiggy]

I work in the electric utility business. I do not work directly with the wind turbines but I can tell you what little I do know regarding generation and transmission. We have 40 year contracts with many different wind farms. Our electric grid is supplied by coal, gas, nuclear, hydro, wind and solar. Hydro being the cheapest and wind and solar being the most expensive per MW/HR. With the wind power contracts we are buying MW's for anywhere from $59-79 dollars a MW (transmission interconnection fees are also figured into this). If the wind turbine is turning we are required to buy it even if we can produce it for cheaper. Our cheapest hydro units can produce for $2/MW. Our combined cycle and combustion turbines are anywhere from $9/MW to $25/MW. Our coal units run anywhere from $17/MW to $28/MW. The nuke units stay base loaded at around $5-6/MW. Someone with more knowledge may correct me but each wind turbine only produces around +-3/MW and can only operate within a certain wind speed range. As with any "green" power, they are not a reliable source of generation compared to coal, gas and nuclear. I have been told that the O and M costs are very high and without govt subsidies they would have a hard time making any profits. The cost of wind power or any "green energy" is high and unreliable and that cost will eventually make its way to the consumer. In my opinion it is crazy to buy megawatts for $59-79/mw when we can make it for so much cheaper and with a more reliable source. As I said at the beginning, I don't work directly with the wind power side of the business so maybe somebody with more knowledge and info will chime in.

This is pretty much spot on.
Also, the carbon footprint making these things will never "compensate" on what they generate.

[100%TtId]

I work in the electric utility business. I do not work directly with the wind turbines but I can tell you what little I do know regarding generation and transmission. We have 40 year contracts with many different wind farms. Our electric grid is supplied by coal, gas, nuclear, hydro, wind and solar. Hydro being the cheapest and wind and solar being the most expensive per MW/HR. With the wind power contracts we are buying MW's for anywhere from $59-79 dollars a MW (transmission interconnection fees are also figured into this). If the wind turbine is turning we are required to buy it even if we can produce it for cheaper. Our cheapest hydro units can produce for $2/MW. Our combined cycle and combustion turbines are anywhere from $9/MW to $25/MW. Our coal units run anywhere from $17/MW to $28/MW. The nuke units stay base loaded at around $5-6/MW. Someone with more knowledge may correct me but each wind turbine only produces around +-3/MW and can only operate within a certain wind speed range. As with any "green" power, they are not a reliable source of generation compared to coal, gas and nuclear. I have been told that the O and M costs are very high and without govt subsidies they would have a hard time making any profits. The cost of wind power or any "green energy" is high and unreliable and that cost will eventually make its way to the consumer. In my opinion it is crazy to buy megawatts for $59-79/mw when we can make it for so much cheaper and with a more reliable source. As I said at the beginning, I don't work directly with the wind power side of the business so maybe somebody with more knowledge and info will chime in.

Nailed it ^^^

Solar and wind require not only govt subsidies to exist, but they get market advantages also as you noted. Renewables get priority in the day-ahead and real-time auctions on most grids like ERCOT, SWPP, MISO, etc. Wind and offshore wind specifically is the most expensive power generated by 4 or 5x and has to be back-stopped by non-renewable sources for reliability.

[Dale Moser]

The folks selling wind energy, are the same morons who put restrictive exhaust systems on Diesel engines to make them run 8% cleaner while using 13% more fuel, and creating a bunch more trash with the additive containers for the additive.

Morons.

Wind energy is a farce, in the long run.


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[GA Bowhunter]

It's been a long while so I can't quote specifics, but 10 or 12 years ago my business partners and I were at a wealth management firm getting a pitch on buying federal and state tax credits.

Georgia has a 6% state income tax and you could buy $1 of state tax credits for 25 cents. You had to buy $250,000 worth of state tax credits in a bundle. The beauty of a tax credit as opposed to a deduction is that if you make $1,000,000 in GA you have a 60k state tax bill. for 15k you can buy 60k worth of credits and wipe out your tax bill.

Federal tax credits were not very appealing. They traded near face value and even above face value(that was not explained in a way I could understand).

When we asked how we could generate out own federal tax credits the guys said there were several ways but the most lucrative was wind energy.
They gave us an overview of the process.
It may have changed, but the business model back then was generating federal tax credits.

Around here there are no windmills, solar farms are sprouting up all over. Must be the same scam.

[RiverRat1]

Lets say someone signs a 40 year contact and has 5 turbines on their property. If/when this scam goes belly up and they stop getting paid for the turbines can they legally knock them down?

[Farmdog]

Solar is your next eyesore and construction has already begun.

[Farmdog]

I get 3 turbines and my parents get 2, it’s a 35 year deal and we already regret signing

[bboswell]

I get 3 turbines and my parents get 2, it’s a 35 year deal and we already regret signing

Ouch!

[Texans42]

Lets say someone signs a 40 year contact and has 5 turbines on their property. If/when this scam goes belly up and they stop getting paid for the turbines can they legally knock them down?

Depends on contract, you should have a reclamation trust set up.

[Texans42]

Solar is your next eyesore and construction has already begun.

I had very nice contract for couple sections, they pulled out right when trump was elected

[Farmdog]

I received another Solar deal request in the mail today, 58 cent cotton leaves no room for armchair quarterback waxing on what you would do if it was you. Trade war is pushing me toward the hippies my perspective is different. I was too embarrassed to install all those solar panels and worried what it would look like for my 3 neighbors. I was the last holdout to sign with wind, my oldest son has said several times that I will have trouble with all of them. It’s a mess for sure. The electric grid running through the middle is what interests them I believe

[Farmdog]

I need a lawyer in my pickup

[Dale Moser]

I need a lawyer in my pickup

You have one in your garage apartment!

[Texans42]

I received another Solar deal request in the mail today, 58 cent cotton leaves no room for armchair quarterback waxing on what you would do if it was you. Trade war is pushing me toward the hippies my perspective is different. I was too embarrassed to install all those solar panels and worried what it would look like for my 3 neighbors. I was the last holdout to sign with wind, my oldest son has said several times that I will have trouble with all of them. It’s a mess for sure. The electric grid running through the middle is what interests them I believe

My proposal was on a piece that between the soil bank contract and cattle lease it brought in a whooping $13 an acre. Pretty easy decision, let the prairie dogs be someone elses problem for a change.

Trade war isn’t bothering me, I got pretty ticked off with China’s manipulation of the corn market a few years ago and diversified as much as possible

[Farmdog]

My corn goes to Mex, but

.... I will put solar beneath turbines and grow medicinal herb and eat my cattle, bbq is in!