Illegal immigration and the conservative brand

[XBowHunter]

Are you saying an illegal workforce being employed for less money than the typical american would get paid is a good thing?

no, i am trying to get you to admit that greedy business's who send jobs to asia for cheap labor are hurting the american worker also. it's not just illegal immigrants.

outsourcing has costs many, many americans their jobs...

[kyle1974]

no, i am trying to get you to admit that greedy business's who send jobs to asia for cheap labor are hurting the american worker also. it's not just illegal immigrants.

outsourcing has costs many, many americans their jobs...

or maybe it's the greedy consumer that demands the lowest price?

take a look around you. I realize technology is more prevalent than 30 years ago when I was a kid, but consumers are greedy too. how much stuff do we need? I know I have way more stuff than my parents did. Somehow, they lived without it.

[Playa]

do you guys that want them out all together so americans can have those jobs also decry american companies that send their jobs overseas for cheaper labor?

Yes.

no, i am trying to get you to admit that greedy business's who send jobs to asia for cheap labor are hurting the american worker also. it's not just illegal immigrants.

outsourcing has costs many, many americans their jobs...

Jobs sent to Asia is more complex than just cheap labor. Environmental policy has made it early impossible to manufacture here stateside. Then again, I'm glad we an see the blue sky most days through the smog

[treestand]

Did you know that the biggest benefits a company that moves overseas gets are reduced regulations and lower corporate taxes? Lower labor cost is third on the list at most, and less important than that in many countries. Just look around where you work. How many people spend a big portion of their time doing government paperwork or other government mandated tasks?

[Ætheling]

no, i am trying to get you to admit that greedy business's who send jobs to asia for cheap labor are hurting the american worker also. it's not just illegal immigrants.

outsourcing has costs many, many americans their jobs...

I think the free market in a laissez faire system can correct both. If the govt stops giving handouts and allowing employers to break the law the illegals will leave. If the govt stops taxing the hell out of businesses they will stop going overseas.

[JGreen31]

I don't know about in all industry but that's not the case in mine, I pay enough to if you work for me most of the time you are in to 6 figures. I have helpers making 50,000 a year but we also work 84 hour weeks most of the time. When I start looking for people they are usually all in until they realize you have to work your butt off.

What are the hours you are working those guys to have them working 84 hours week after week?

[Ham Slammer]

What are the hours you are working those guys to have them working 84 hours week after week?

84 hours = 7 x 12 hour days

[JGreen31]

That's hard to sustain a steady work crew even paying them $15 bucks an hour... If they worked them 7's for 52 straight weeks they could pull in 40k after taxes, but what person can sustain, including illegal immigrants working that schedule.

[donpablo]

Amnesty for a Price

I've been saying for a long time that an amnesty program could be a good thing if done correctly.

- Create a program for the illegals to enter that upon completion would grant citizenship
- Immediately stop any and all welfare/gov't assistance to anyone within the household of a non-citizens (those entering program would not be eligible for assistance as they would still not be citizens)
- Monitor heavily any/all program participants to ensure they are following all laws and program rules
- Those in the program should be made to pay a monthly penalty so that by the time they complete the program they will have paid twice the amount it would have cost to immigrate legally
- Crack down on any new illegal immigrants entering after inception of the program
- Require a visit with BP for anyone stopped without a valid, state issued license
- Mandate that any visitor to the local ER without a valid, state issued license meet with the BP after treatment (people within the program and not able to pay would have the bill added to their program penalty and would not be able to complete the program until they pay the entire balance)
- Criminal acts perpetrated by the children (whether the child is a citizen or not) of those in the program would result in the program participant's deportation.
- Require the children of participants to attend school regularly, behave while there and pass their classes (failing could be overlooked if the child can prove they are attending tutoring regularly)

Done correctly the program would pay for itself and would only grant citizenship to the hard working, honest, productive immigrants. If created and passed by the Republican party, this would also boost their numbers as the people who fit this mold usually have conservative, Christian values.

[Artos]

None of the candidates are even addressing a solution to stopping the problem...it's a joke. Rounding them all up is no different than flipping the hour glass over, only to watch the same grains of sand return. Amnesty has proven that the current system is flawed & makes us look foolish for having an immigration with no consequences. Why even have the law if you give people a pass for breaking it??

Unless we revamp the laws & implement a good accountable process of the immigrant path to citizenship, the issue will continue as we know it...folks, it's madness really.

Our current system encourages the problem we all complain about...it HAS to be redone & if the masses had any idea of the actual bs, they would have a better understanding & direct their anger where it belongs. I blame the Govt & current laws for the vast portion of this whole mess we are in. Living in the valley & having worked in Mexico off and on over the past 15 years, I know a bit about the misplaced anger people have.


~I have watched several friends spend an insane amount of time & crazy money to become US citizens...these are middle income folks making a darn good living working in the maquila industry. (yes, you have to have a US paying job already lined up to get rolling) I would say about 20% gave up from the hoops they had to go through even after forking over lots of $$$$

~How is the average lower income family go about this if the priviledged struggle?? What would you do to get out of a 3rd world country if the process is set up to deny??

~Have loads of $$$, no problem...come on down.

~If you are a rich middle eastern individual who wants a student visa...no problem either, come on in as well & we can do the vetting later.


Gang, it's a freak'n joke that could be made better but I really don't think the govt wants to fix it...a wall really isn't a solution to the underlying issue. It's Washington who wants the piglets on the teats & sacrifices our safety doing so. Wouldn't be that hard to help the good folks who would contribute to our tax base in, and keep the thugs / terrorists out.

Other Countries have a pretty good handle.

[fox1]

That's hard to sustain a steady work crew even paying them $15 bucks an hour... If they worked them 7's for 52 straight weeks they could pull in 40k after taxes, but what person can sustain, including illegal immigrants working that schedule.

I worked 7-12s for the first 20 years of my adult life. Then when I got into supervision it was 7-13s and 7-16s.
On my tools I worked that schedule for about 8 months a year, as a supervisor I did it for about 10 months a year
As an owner now I'm always on call.
There is a large part of the population that does this year in and year out. And for 15 an hour I couldn't hire a tool room guy much less a trained craftsman

[JGreen31]

That's pretty amazing for sure .... 7-12's with zero days off... For 20 years. I wouldn't do it.

[Speedgoat]

That's pretty amazing for sure .... 7-12's with zero days off... For 20 years. I wouldn't do it.

And I don't buy it.

[muzzlebrake]

Anybody ever been a dairy farmer? Them old cows don't get a day off either.
Milking starts at 5am. Milking stops around 8pm. Cleanup and feeding in between and if there's time you got feed crops to tend to. 7 days a week x 365 x 12 to 16hrs a day. Not all dairies have hired hands. My parents didn't. After 3 years my Dad said to heck with this so he sold out and bought a gas station in town so he could have Sunday off. He still worked 12 hour days.

[Mike Javi Cooper]

Twenty-five years ago I was paying $8 an hour to run a grain scoop and push broom cleaning out fertilizer barges and storage bins. I had lots of applicants for the jobs, but I never had a single gringo last more than eight hours before quitting... The Mexican workers, all of which had green cards, and SS cards got the same pay....

I never had a Mexican tell me that the work was too hard for the pay...


You want to shut this down... Okay

Cut off all government assistance to anyone without either citizenship or valid visa, no school, no healthcare beyond emergency care, no school, no food, and no job...

Make it a $10K fine per person for anyone to knowingly employ anyone not a US citizen or holder of a valid work visa.

Make it a mandatory 10 years in Federal lockup to anyone who knowingly employs illegals a second time..

Deport illegals when they're picked up, no exceptions