What would you do- Guy walks in Walmart with assult gun

[Ironman]

Not sure about the vigilante want to be hero, but the white jeep stalker I get.

[WCB]

JT, do you cook boudin??

[Gbird]

I'm glad you brought up Terry vs Ohio... I fail to see what "reasonable suspicion of a crime" an individual exercising their 2A right meets.



No one is arguing the fact that law enforcement has right to disarm someone that has commited a crime or has been suspected of a commiting crime. We are talking about someone not breaking the law but being harassed by law enforcement for exercising a right. That right can be 1A, 2A, 15A etc... all rights should be just as respected as the next right. Therefore, all 3 analogies I provided are relevant.



You can tell me it is about Officer safety blah blah blah but you and I both know it is about control. Conducting yourself in a lawful manner (armed or not) should not warrant being detained by a LEO.

We, as law enforcement, will probably always disarm any person that we come into contact with. You're under the assumption that the law enforcement officer is contacting the person under a consensual encounter. I'm talking about an officer contacting somebody that has been called in on for being suspicious. And I can guarantee if you walk into our local Wal-Mart with a long gun strapped to your body, you will get called in on probably before you even hit the front doors. In our community, it is not NORMAL for somebody to walk around with a long gun in the open. We've even had a shooting death in out Wal-Mart in recent history and it is still fresh on the minds of our officers who responded and the community. If somebody walking around in a public place with a long gun exposed is normal in your community, the officers will probably handle it differently. How do I know that while it is within your right to walk around with a long gun exposed, you're not some whack-a-doodle that is looking for his ex-girlfriend, wife, etc who might be shopping there or an employee there to take out?? I can't just sit back and watch you walk around Wal-Mart all day waiting for that person to make a threatening move. What if that person walks into Wal-Mart and the police gets called. I show up and say, "Sorry folks, there is nothing I can do. He is just exercising his rights to openly carry his long gun." I never contact that person or do any type of investigation. Then that person decides to go on a shooting rampage. What kinda crack will my behind be in then? Not only civilly, but with my department? It's a "****ed if I do, ****ed if I don't" scenario. But I'd rather error on the side of caution and make contact with that person, detain and disarm for a few moments, perform my investigation, and then let him go on his way.

[BIG IRON]

We, as law enforcement, will probably always disarm any person that we come into contact with. You're under the assumption that the law enforcement officer is contacting the person under a consensual encounter. I'm talking about an officer contacting somebody that has been called in on for being suspicious. And I can guarantee if you walk into our local Wal-Mart with a long gun strapped to your body, you will get called in on probably before you even hit the front doors. In our community, it is not NORMAL for somebody to walk around with a long gun in the open. We've even had a shooting death in out Wal-Mart in recent history and it is still fresh on the minds of our officers who responded and the community. If somebody walking around in a public place with a long gun exposed is normal in your community, the officers will probably handle it differently. How do I know that while it is within your right to walk around with a long gun exposed, you're not some whack-a-doodle that is looking for his ex-girlfriend, wife, etc who might be shopping there or an employee there to take out?? I can't just sit back and watch you walk around Wal-Mart all day waiting for that person to make a threatening move. What if that person walks into Wal-Mart and the police gets called. I show up and say, "Sorry folks, there is nothing I can do. He is just exercising his rights to openly carry his long gun." I never contact that person or do any type of investigation. Then that person decides to go on a shooting rampage. What kinda crack will my behind be in then? Not only civilly, but with my department? It's a "****ed if I do, ****ed if I don't" scenario. But I'd rather error on the side of caution and make contact with that person, detain and disarm for a few moments, perform my investigation, and then let him go on his way.

That sounds like talk from a liberal elite

[VorTexan]

That sounds like talk from a liberal elite

Could be Moonwalking this late at night.

[Gbird]

That sounds like talk from a liberal elite

Call me what you will, but I'm going home at the end of my shift.

[Daniel75]

Call me what you will, but I'm going home at the end of my shift.

He's actually making fun of the other guy, he agrees with you.

[bsimm78]

I would run to the sporting goods section, grab the fastest .22 caliber pellet gun I could find, take it out of the box, load it, and put 1 pellet in his ear.

[GatorBait]

I agree that it would be better for us if the public saw more responsible "non-crazy" gun owners. I just think there are better ways to go about showcasing responsible gun ownership and second amendment rights than a bunch of people walking around Walmart with rifles. I've had to go to many demonstrations at walmarts in my area where there are a bunch of ****** of guys with rifles walking around as if they were daring anyone to say anything. Like it or not, we don't live in a society where that is the norm, and I can't see those tactics winning over anyone who is on the fence when it comes to gun control.

So.... what is your better way? Sit at home and hope the government abides by the constitution? There may be a better way, everyone keeps saying that, but no one knows what it is. Just saying, the left has an agenda, and it has demonized guns the whole way. That is the only reason we are having this conversation now. There was a time when guns were viewed in a different light. Guess what comes after banning open carry on long guns? That's right, banning us crazy hunters from carrying them to hunt.

[Tommyh]

Two things and then ill let you guys go back to pointless banter.


LEO has a requirement and duty to engage the individual that has a call placed against them, especially when a firearm is involved, regardless of legal or not. It's your job, and you keep on doing it to the best of your ability, as expected, and be safe!

To the 2A guys, there has to be a two pronged approach that HAS to happen in order for your legal activities to be accepted by the general public.

1. The onslaught of liberal bias and emotional knee jerk reactions over the last few decades has hammered into generations of kids in school, in the news, and in Congresses across the country that guns are evil. They cause death, mayhem and destruction. They control the message and their PR campaign is light years ahead of anyone who supports 2A, to include the NRA. You have to overcome their message with just as harsh of a reaction with FACTS and take the message back. You have to expose the liberal lie, the agenda they intend to impose on everyone, and most importantly, you have to expose the real issues with mental instabilities and the liberal political correctness that crazies can't be locked up if they dont want to be.

2.In your rallies, you have to conduct yourselves with as much respect towards LEO and counter protesters, same as the TEA party has done. Be prepared to have thick skin because youre going to be a pariah, and a political target. Ostricize any and every person who behaves in a manner unsafe, unstable, or inflammatory. Lobby State congress to keep it on the books. Just because people think it is unsafe or "not normal", remember that they have been brain washed into thinking guns are bad. Liken it to old land owners who dont or didnt like bowhunters because arrows arent lethal or bowhunting isnt good.

[Codie]

http://law.justia.com/cases/texas/fi...0157-cr-6.html

If you will notice I said (IN MY OPINION)

I don't give a rats tail of a courts opinion in 2008 - If I see someone walking around in public with an exposed weapon I am IMMEDIATELY on alert because I know that there is no need for it. We have CHL license opportunities and if you want to carry for protection then that is perfectly fine, but it should be concealed so as not to cause alarm to everyone else around you. Carrying around a long gun is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I have lived for 31 years in one of the most right wing, conservative, rights protected areas of the state and have NEVER seen anyone carrying a long gun around in public other than at a gunshow. I don't know anybody here that does NOT own a long gun of some sort and plenty of them own AR type weapons as well so obviously there is plenty of folks with common sense around here as well.

[Tommyh]

If you will notice I said (IN MY OPINION)

I don't give a rats tail of a courts opinion in 2008 - If I see someone walking around in public with an exposed weapon I am IMMEDIATELY on alert because I know that there is no need for it. We have CHL license opportunities and if you want to carry for protection then that is perfectly fine, but it should be concealed so as not to cause alarm to everyone else around you. Carrying around a long gun is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I have lived for 31 years in one of the most right wing, conservative, rights protected areas of the state and have NEVER seen anyone carrying a long gun around in public other than at a gunshow. I don't know anybody here that does NOT own a long gun of some sort and plenty of them own AR type weapons as well so obviously there is plenty of folks with common sense around here as well.

being on alert is a good thing. however, just because you dont think someone NEEDS to do something doesnt mean it isnt right or legal, and that is the issue here. replace that with magazine limit, ability to petition the gov't for greivance or right to vote. heck, imagine the uproar here if prohibition were re enacted, or even %age of alcohol lowered on certain beverages because someone says that it doesnt NEED to be that high. caliber max size and powder capacity to limit velocity?

Your discomfort stops where my rights begin. this all is part of the misinformation and miseducation of firearms talked about earlier. Believe it or not, there are people out there with the same mentality for your health insurance

[txsowslayer]

If you will notice I said (IN MY OPINION)

I don't give a rats tail of a courts opinion in 2008 - If I see someone walking around in public with an exposed weapon I am IMMEDIATELY on alert because I know that there is no need for it. We have CHL license opportunities and if you want to carry for protection then that is perfectly fine, but it should be concealed so as not to cause alarm to everyone else around you. Carrying around a long gun is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I have lived for 31 years in one of the most right wing, conservative, rights protected areas of the state and have NEVER seen anyone carrying a long gun around in public other than at a gunshow. I don't know anybody here that does NOT own a long gun of some sort and plenty of them own AR type weapons as well so obviously there is plenty of folks with common sense around here as well.

If there is no need for open carry there is no need for a CHL. Your statement is a huge contradiction.

[TXHUNT3R]

I don't see that you did anything wrong at all. I would have reacted the same way.

[txsowslayer]

If you will notice I said (IN MY OPINION)

I don't give a rats tail of a courts opinion in 2008 - If I see someone walking around in public with an exposed weapon I am IMMEDIATELY on alert because I know that there is no need for it. We have CHL license opportunities and if you want to carry for protection then that is perfectly fine, but it should be concealed so as not to cause alarm to everyone else around you. Carrying around a long gun is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I have lived for 31 years in one of the most right wing, conservative, rights protected areas of the state and have NEVER seen anyone carrying a long gun around in public other than at a gunshow. I don't know anybody here that does NOT own a long gun of some sort and plenty of them own AR type weapons as well so obviously there is plenty of folks with common sense around here as well.

BTW, wasn't a poll tax struck down by the supreme court? Why should someone have to pay a tax to exercise their 2A rights that were outlined in the Bill of Rights?