Long Range Elk Rifle

[jstanton]

The Question:
What should I do? Invest in what I have or start over?

The Backstory:
I have been blessed to be able to go Elk hunting in Colorado the last two consecutive years. The first year was a dream and I shot a nice 6x6 bull on opening day of the second season at 375 yards. Last year I went for the first season and hunted a grueling 7 days before finally harvesting a respectable 5x6 bull at 450 yards. I missed an opportunity at a monster 7x7 because he was out of range for me at 750 yards with no chance of getting closer. I am getting to go again this year and am considering a new rifle. We hunt public land around Lake City.

I hunted both years with a Weatherby Vanguard 7mm Rem Mag with a Nikon Buckmaster 4.5x14x40 scope and Federal Premium 150 grain Trophy Copper. Both elk dropped in their tracks after one shot. This rifle is a great shooter and I can consistently shoot 1" groups @ 100 yards and am comfortable with this set up out to about 500 yards. I bought both the gun and scope new and have about $650 in the rig. I spent alot of money and time on factory ammo to find out what it liked best in preparation for my elk hunt, thus ammo selection above. I originally put this set up together as a Texas deer/pig gun to keep in the truck but when the opportunity arose to go elk hunting it was my best option to take. I am still surprised that this $399 rifle shot so well out of the box and it isn't even one of the newer Vanguards that guarantee sub-moa accuracy.

I guess I have a stigma about doing any work to this rifle or putting expensive optics on it, being that it is a $399 Vanguard, to extend my effective range with it. So should I invest in a better scope and accurizing this rifle out to 800 yards or should I start over with a different rifle and caliber?

If I should start over, what would be the best caliber/rifle for Elk hunting in Colorado out to 800 yards? Off the shelf or build? Budget approximately $1,000 not including optics.

Thank you in advance for any advise!

[noack920]

Try and get a hold of Cajun Blake and get some advise. I think he knows of a place to get affordable builds. He might be able to find you an older 700 action. That would be best bet right around a grand I believe. Also my vote would be 7 mag.

[gumbl3]

My vote would be to spend a little money on an aftermarket stock and trigger. Sell the nikon and stock and use the rest to upgrade the optics. It could all be done for $1000. 1" is groups is right there on the fringe of minute of elk at 800 IMO but tightening up just a little and I would think that should make for an ethical shot if you do your part.

[JakeGraves]

Your 7 mag will work if you upgrade the glass and practice. If you are 1 moa at 100 and can judge wind, angle, correct BC, and so forth, getting 1 moa at 800 is still within an elks lungs. Inconsistencies are magnified at longer ranges and the key to accuracy is consistency. Practice at 1000 to hunt at 800.

[Cajun Blake]

ditto what others have said

the 7 mag will kill elk at 750 yds. Upgrade the glass, handload, possible stock upgrade and/or pillar&glass bed, and practice practice practice

[trophy8]

Have you ran that ammo over a chronograph to see how consistent it is? Won't matter if the gun shoots 1/4" groups at 100 if it's not consistent. Whole different world when you start stretching them out 600-700+.

[Slick8]

I agree with all that's stated above.

Adding to that, I looked up the ballistics of your chosen round and assuming a minimum velocity threshold of 2000 FPS and Energy of 1500 pounds, your load runs out of gas at just over 500 yards. You could do yourself a favor by reloading or trying something with a higher BC. That's not to say it won't kill from farther out but bullet performance is questionable. Federal doesn't publicize the minimum velocity threshold in which that bullet will reliably perform. You should contact them for this info as it will aid you in determining the max velocity of the round. If you really like the copper solid, take a look at the Vortex line of ammo, they have the original Barnes bullets which include the TTSX.

Next, I'd spend all or most of my budget on glass. You could easily spend the 1K on the scope alone....Or you could buy a Vortex 4-16 PST ($650) and still have some trigger / stock money left over. Buy a Timney or have yours re-worked and $100 for a Boyds Laminate, then float the barrel and bed the action. That's a $1 total refit....Matt, Don't beat me up over the big V....

[txhoghunter73]

The Question:
What should I do? Invest in what I have or start over?

The Backstory:
I have been blessed to be able to go Elk hunting in Colorado the last two consecutive years. The first year was a dream and I shot a nice 6x6 bull on opening day of the second season at 375 yards. Last year I went for the first season and hunted a grueling 7 days before finally harvesting a respectable 5x6 bull at 450 yards. I missed an opportunity at a monster 7x7 because he was out of range for me at 750 yards with no chance of getting closer. I am getting to go again this year and am considering a new rifle. We hunt public land around Lake City.

I hunted both years with a Weatherby Vanguard 7mm Rem Mag with a Nikon Buckmaster 4.5x14x40 scope and Federal Premium 150 grain Trophy Copper. Both elk dropped in their tracks after one shot. This rifle is a great shooter and I can consistently shoot 1" groups @ 100 yards and am comfortable with this set up out to about 500 yards. I bought both the gun and scope new and have about $650 in the rig. I spent alot of money and time on factory ammo to find out what it liked best in preparation for my elk hunt, thus ammo selection above. I originally put this set up together as a Texas deer/pig gun to keep in the truck but when the opportunity arose to go elk hunting it was my best option to take. I am still surprised that this $399 rifle shot so well out of the box and it isn't even one of the newer Vanguards that guarantee sub-moa accuracy.

I guess I have a stigma about doing any work to this rifle or putting expensive optics on it, being that it is a $399 Vanguard, to extend my effective range with it. So should I invest in a better scope and accurizing this rifle out to 800 yards or should I start over with a different rifle and caliber?

If I should start over, what would be the best caliber/rifle for Elk hunting in Colorado out to 800 yards? Off the shelf or build? Budget approximately $1,000 not including optics.

Thank you in advance for any advise!

If your strong enough, I'd go with my set up remington 700 sendero sf2 300 RUM vortex hs-t 6-24x50 running 200 Grain Accubonds in nosler cases over Retumbo or IMR 7828. This really breaks auodad down, I could imagine it does the same to elk.

[elkaholic9292]

7 Mag is my favorite all around rifle for elk or whitetail. Has nothing to do with being "strong enough". I'm 6'4 260#, but why punish yourself if you don't have to. To answer your question, I personally wouldn't invest the money in that rifle. That is a magnificent animal (not like a pig) to take that shot without top notch equipment with top notch optics, and tailored loads for that specific rifle, you're better off closing the distance with the setup you have.

[jstanton]

Thank you to everyone for all the advise.

I still cannot make up my mind if I want to invest the money in a new stock, trigger and gunsmithing for the Vanguard or just build new off a Rem 700 action.

Is it realistic to think I could build a 1000 yard target/800 yard hunting 7mm Mag for $1000? (Not including optics)

Either way I am going with new optics and leaning towards a Vortex Viper HS 6-24×50 with 30mm tube.

Thanks Again!

[niceg3s]

If you want a long range rifle, as others suggested, get into the 700 platform with a 300 win mag, and up the money you want to spend.

I'm comfortable shooting 450 yards with a 3x9 Leupold, factory stock, factory trigger weight, factory loads, 300 win mag. I'll attach a picture. I think the nikon is a good scope, and I wouldn't want much more magnification. This is probably not the answer you want, but in truth, I would not take 750 yard shots on elk.

If you are going to take 750 yard shots, and if you are comfortable with your rig, then I wouldn't change a thing in regards to stock and trigger or you will have to re-learn your shooting process. Spend your money on glass. As you will see from my picture, I use a BOSS (b/c I'm a pansie), bipod, and, you may not see, my shooting strap. I find them useful, but some will disagree.

I don't like high magnification scopes as I lose my field of view, which limits my ability to shoot animals when they are running, but again that's personal preference. Optics preference in order Nightforce, Swarovski, Zeiss, Leupold, Nikon, again opinion not fact.

My rifle is a Winchester Model 70 Classic Laredo Long Range Hunter in .300 Winchester Magnum equiped with a BOSS system. I would recommend the 700 platform over the M70. I like the M70 better, but you really limit yourself on mods.

[ballfroguy]

Off the shelf Savage Model 111 LRH in 300 win mag. Comes with all upgrades and an on/off brake on it.

[WKH2213]

Long Range Elk Rifle

This is my build for long range hunting. 300 win mag
I took Blakes suggestion and had Alamo Precision do the build.
I know it's over the $1k budget you mentioned, but it shoots like a dream.
Your 7 mag is plenty of gun, just build it up and enjoy.
Definitely work on load development and you'll be good to go.

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[jstanton]

Wow those are some sweet rifles!

I really like the Alamo Precision build. I think Im in love!

Well looks like Im gonna sell my Weatherby setup to help fund an AP build!

Thanks WKH2213!

[Slick8]

I wasn't going to go there with the custom suggestion as I feared it was beyond your planned budget...we all know how long that last....

You should be able to sell that Vanguard for about what a Model 700 cost then the build price can vary depending on options.

I added to my build price with a muzzle brake then blew it with an additional $300 in added cost of the McM stock which I found on another site.

Here's mine. I'm a bit limited in hand loading experience but have some good teachers; both on here and family.

In some very limited range sessions, I've managed two different loads under .5moa at 100 and am just tweaking seating depth at this time.