This is what they want investigated

[flywise]

Hasn't antifa been designated a terrorist organization?

Yep

[flywise]

Genuinely, curious, what bothers both of you about the arrest? Their uniforms, the unmarked van, or that they didn't stop and have a chat with the protesters, give them their names, business cards, and home address?

I guess these officers should suffer some trauma before making an arrest to make it more legit.
I’m fairly certain unmarked police vehicles and unmarked police officers have been arresting people as long as I have been alive ( 50 years )

[Riceguy]

Genuinely, curious, what bothers both of you about the arrest? Their uniforms, the unmarked van, or that they didn't stop and have a chat with the protesters, give them their names, business cards, and home address?

Pretty much all of the above. It's just not transparent and there's talk about spreading elsewhere. This is what a police state looks like.

Law enforcement officers are here to protect and serve. Early on, they went out swinging and injured alot of peaceful protesters and reporters before damage occurred in many cities.

I liked the way Fort Worth officers handled the protesters by not trying to attack them and just did their job. They didn't run out there trying to meet force with force, etc. Even the President had peaceful protesters teargassed for a photo op. It just reeks of government control and suppression.

In my mind protesters and looters/rioters are completely different. Every looter/rioter should be arrested on the spot. People should not be "kidnapped" by unmarked people in rental cars.

It's a sad situation for the country and we have a president who praises dictators for their "strength" in dealing with opponents. I don't want our country to become like China and Russia with state-controlled secret police and people mysteriously disappearing.

Probably more than you asked with a little rambling, but I just finished working for the night and am going to bed.

[Ironman]

Pretty much all of the above. It's just not transparent and there's talk about spreading elsewhere. This is what a police state looks like.

Law enforcement officers are here to protect and serve. Early on, they went out swinging and injured alot of peaceful protesters and reporters before damage occurred in many cities.

I liked the way Fort Worth officers handled the protesters by not trying to attack them and just did their job. They didn't run out there trying to meet force with force, etc. Even the President had peaceful protesters teargassed for a photo op. It just reeks of government control and suppression.

In my mind protesters and looters/rioters are completely different. Every looter/rioter should be arrested on the spot. People should not be "kidnapped" by unmarked people in rental cars.

It's a sad situation for the country and we have a president who praises dictators for their "strength" in dealing with opponents. I don't want our country to become like China and Russia with state-controlled secret police and people mysteriously disappearing.

Probably more than you asked with a little rambling, but I just finished working for the night and am going to bed.

Once again, show me footage of “peaceful protestors” being wronged. I have your back if you can prove your statements.

[DRettele]

I've only seen a couple of these videos showing the "protestors" being arrested and put into unmarked minivans. Both of them had audio and at the very beginning I heard the officers state things like "we have you on video throwing a molotov cocktail..."
I don't have links to the videos I've seen posted to Twitter.

So, my thought on this is that there has been video evidence collected and they are locating these individuals and arresting them after they have been identified.

[Ironman]

I've only seen a couple of these videos showing the "protestors" being arrested and put into unmarked minivans. Both of them had audio and at the very beginning I heard the officers state things like "we have you on video throwing a molotov cocktail..."
I don't have links to the videos I've seen posted to Twitter.

So, my thought on this is that there has been video evidence collected and they are locating these individuals and arresting them after they have been identified.

Well, that sounds logical.

[Rigging Cooks]

Hey Riceguy no teargas was used on anybody in the park when President stood in front of a burned Church. Don't watch main stream media, it makes morons out of watchers.

[flywise]

Wonder if riceguy had a problem with a us president who
Used his power and the highest gov. Police force to try and over turn an election and over throw an President.
Returned 150 billion to a dictatorship who disappear people all the time when they are not throwing them off roof tops.

As long as we have someone like TRUMP in office you don’t have to worry about “ turning into” a place like china

[Playa]

Pretty much all of the above. It's just not transparent and there's talk about spreading elsewhere. This is what a police state looks like.

Law enforcement officers are here to protect and serve. Early on, they went out swinging and injured alot of peaceful protesters and reporters before damage occurred in many cities.

I liked the way Fort Worth officers handled the protesters by not trying to attack them and just did their job. They didn't run out there trying to meet force with force, etc. Even the President had peaceful protesters teargassed for a photo op. It just reeks of government control and suppression.

In my mind protesters and looters/rioters are completely different. Every looter/rioter should be arrested on the spot. People should not be "kidnapped" by unmarked people in rental cars.

It's a sad situation for the country and we have a president who praises dictators for their "strength" in dealing with opponents. I don't want our country to become like China and Russia with state-controlled secret police and people mysteriously disappearing.

Probably more than you asked with a little rambling, but I just finished working for the night and am going to bed.

Have you noticed that it is only spreading to the areas where RIOTS are occurring. If we are calling a spade a spade then let’s do it. These arent “peaceful protests,” hell they aren’t even protests. When you start burning buildings, smashing windows, assaulting people, and destroying history there is one word and only one word, and it is RIOT.

Feds aren’t bumping in Lubbock Texas snatching folks up. Not even dallas or houston. The only place where a show of force has occurred is where there is rioting.

This isn’t a police state. These groups have had 2 months to voice their concerns in a largely unfettered manner. The state and local
Governments have done jack squat. And the feds are intervening to protect federal monuments, and buildings.

Here is the single biggest issue for our nation and it is accepting responsibility for our actions and it occurs on both the left & right. Currently we have groups hellbent on destruction, their state and local governments haven’t intervened. And they seem shocked and upset that an authority would hold them accountable for their actions of destroying both public and private property.

You talk about “protect and serve”.... that’s a dichotomy. They are here to protect and serve the LAWFUL FROM THE UNLAWFUL.

[manwitaplan]

Pretty much all of the above. It's just not transparent and there's talk about spreading elsewhere. This is what a police state looks like.

Law enforcement officers are here to protect and serve. Early on, they went out swinging and injured alot of peaceful protesters and reporters before damage occurred in many cities.

I liked the way Fort Worth officers handled the protesters by not trying to attack them and just did their job. They didn't run out there trying to meet force with force, etc. Even the President had peaceful protesters teargassed for a photo op. It just reeks of government control and suppression.

In my mind protesters and looters/rioters are completely different. Every looter/rioter should be arrested on the spot. People should not be "kidnapped" by unmarked people in rental cars.

It's a sad situation for the country and we have a president who praises dictators for their "strength" in dealing with opponents. I don't want our country to become like China and Russia with state-controlled secret police and people mysteriously disappearing.

Probably more than you asked with a little rambling, but I just finished working for the night and am going to bed.

I am all for rounding up idiot violent thugs no matter how they do it. When they arrest the most wanted gang members they task force here in Houston rolls in unmarked cars. What’s the problem?

How do you expect them get to these thugs when the thugs are surrounded by 1000 other thugs.

“Give peace a chance slogan” is not working out to good for the bad guys.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rcole1310]

There has to be law and order. Somebody has to do something. BUT this is a REAL slippery slope guys. These secret police could very easily be pointed the other way. These would be the guys that show up and actually take your guns because the local sheriff won’t do it. All it takes is a different administration with a different agenda and those same boots could be standing on YOUR necks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Playa]

There has to be law and order. Somebody has to do something. BUT this is a REAL slippery slope guys. These secret police could very easily be pointed the other way. These would be the guys that show up and actually take your guns because the local sheriff won’t do it. All it takes is a different administration with a different agenda and those same boots could be standing on YOUR necks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agreed and pointed out early on. But disagree that this is “secret police”. The agencies involved have been open, CBP, ATF etc. Use of unmarked vehicles isn’t new, nor is general use of police versus specified agency. Marked police units have been a specific target.

But I agree with your sentiment, but disagree with this being a “new” risk or new “slope.” Every admin in my life has used unmarked vehicles non agency uniformed officers for certain ops. No outrage then. The only thing new here is that local, county & state offices are allowing this to co ti ur rather than enforce order. That’s is a slippier slope when law abiding citizens cannot trust the basic tenet of law and order will be enforced and basic civility be the norm

[Ironman]

Agreed and pointed out early on. But disagree that this is “secret police”. The agencies involved have been open, CBP, ATF etc. Use of unmarked vehicles isn’t new, nor is general use of police versus specified agency. Marked police units have been a specific target.

But I agree with your sentiment, but disagree with this being a “new” risk or new “slope.” Every admin in my life has used unmarked vehicles non agency uniformed officers for certain ops. No outrage then. The only thing new here is that local, county & state offices are allowing this to co ti ur rather than enforce order. That’s is a slippier slope when law abiding citizens cannot trust the basic tenet of law and order will be enforced and basic civility be the norm

Actually, it’s DHS, which should be dissolved along with repealing The Patriot Act.

[Playa]

Actually, it’s DHS, which should be dissolved along with repealing The Patriot Act.

They were included in the “etc”.... CBP Director has made pubic statements about his agencies involvement.

Can’t argue with your assessment of The Patriot Act.

[philcam]

Pretty much all of the above. It's just not transparent and there's talk about spreading elsewhere. This is what a police state looks like.

Law enforcement officers are here to protect and serve. Early on, they went out swinging and injured alot of peaceful protesters and reporters before damage occurred in many cities.

I liked the way Fort Worth officers handled the protesters by not trying to attack them and just did their job. They didn't run out there trying to meet force with force, etc. Even the President had peaceful protesters teargassed for a photo op. It just reeks of government control and suppression.

In my mind protesters and looters/rioters are completely different. Every looter/rioter should be arrested on the spot. People should not be "kidnapped" by unmarked people in rental cars.

It's a sad situation for the country and we have a president who praises dictators for their "strength" in dealing with opponents. I don't want our country to become like China and Russia with state-controlled secret police and people mysteriously disappearing.

Probably more than you asked with a little rambling, but I just finished working for the night and am going to bed.

Thank you for answering. While I respect your opinion, I disagree with most of it and here in why:

First, I think your idea of a peaceful protest and my idea of a peaceful protest are at different ends of the spectrum. I 100% agree with everyone's right to protest, no matter how much their opinion may differ from mine. I believe defacing property with graffiti, breaking windows, toppling landmarks, arson, throwing rocks, frozen water bottles, fireworks, and homemade explosives is not peaceful, those are rioters, not protesters. We have seen examples of all these behaviors in Portland. To me, an example of a peaceful protest was on January 20, 2020 at the pro-2A protest in Virginia where thousands of armed citizens gathered at the state capitol and no one was hurt, no one was threatened, and nothing was damaged.

Second, about the agents. There are clear markings in yellow on the front of their uniforms that say "POLICE." They also have CBP and Border Patrol patches on their shoulders. CBP leadership has appeared on most news outlets admitting it is CBP agents. It's pretty clear, even the most uniformed, who they are, and its not some "secret" police. Every law enforcement agency has different uniforms, even in their own departments. The Chief = a dress uniform that includes a tie and jacket, the patrol officer = a more traditional uniform, bicycle patrol = shorts and a cycling shirt. Different agencies wear different uniforms. A Texas Ranger in a starched white shirt, Mexican Peso badge, tan slacks, cowboy boots and a 1911 isn't the same as a NYC detective in a suit and tie, but they both dress for their profession. Should an Air Marshal flying on a commercial airliner be required to wear a uniform? Of course not!


Third, the arrest. A little background on Portland. Portland PD, and the local sheriff, under control of the local politicians, have repeatedly refused to assist federal law enforcement agencies since Trump's election. The city has ordered it's police department to have a "hands off" approach to the rioters. The same night this incident happened, a Portland PD station several blocks away was torched by rioters. If the rioters had their way the Mark Hatfield courthouse would become the new CHAZ/CHOP. Every day barricades and fences are erected around the building and every night the rioters tear them down. The Federal agents have instructions to stay inside the building, unless the rioters breached the fences, or otherwise try to vandalize the building. Do some research for yourself, there are several videos of the agents coming out of the building because the rioters had torn down the fences or thrown objects over the fences to try and destroy property. Videos of rioters trying to breach the building with a sledge hammer are available online. When the agents came out, they were attacked with the hammer.

As usual with incidents involving an arrest or use of force, the video is a snap shot of about 15 seconds, and the whole world makes their "informed" decision on those 15 seconds. I watch the video and I see a well executed arrest. Notice the agents walk past and ignore 2 or 3 other rioters who are trying to block them from the guy who gets arrested? The agents didn't engage them, didn't use any force, just simply ignored, walked around them, and took the guy into custody with minimal use of force. No one was harmed, no gas, no batons. Why would they target and arrest just him? Why not grab as many rioters as they can? The fact is, they had been watching this guy throughout the night. He had assaulted other agents by throwing fireworks and rocks at them, he tried to breach entry into the Federal courthouse with a crowbar, and appeared to be a leader who was giving directions to other rioters to do the same. As he started to leave, and fewer rioters were around him (thus making it safer for everyone) the decision was made to take him into custody. Of course that story isn't being shared because it doesn't fit the narrative of "secret boogyman Trump storm troopers." We've seen the media repeatedly use this tactic, showing the police having to use force against rioters, but not what lead up to that use of force.

Last, the "kidnapping" and unmarked vehicle. First, it wasn't a kidnapping. He was arrested, processed and released. He was released because:
1) the Multnomah County jail has decided not to honor it's contract with the U.S. Marshal Service and accept federal prisoners during the riots. Political plain and simple.
2) When you are arrested, if the police want to hold you in custody, you have the right to a detention hearing in front of a judge. The judge will decided if you can be held without bond, required to pay a bond, or released. Since the rioters have effectively shut down the federal courts in Portland, there can't be any hearings. Hopefully, soon, the courthouse can be reopened, the rioters indicted and rearrested.

The unmarked vehicle. Law Enforcement has used unmarked vehicles for decades. I'm sure you know the FBI, ATF, Secret Service, Marshals, ICE, IRS, Postal Inspectors, and every other alphabet 3 letter agency make arrests everyday right? When was the last time you saw a marked FBI Vehicle? ATF? Secret Service?