Shocking?

[3DW5]

Not according to Jesus in John 3:16

If people come to the saving knowledge of Jesus and are not discipled, then how will they know to live a changed life?

Church people (aka”Christians”) need to get off their high horses and in the fight.

It is your job to make disciples....don’t believe me? Read the last few verses of Matthew.

You can not pick one verse out of the whole bible when it comes to eternity. I wish it were that easy...

[Saltaholic]

You can not pick one verse out of the whole bible when it comes to eternity. I wish it were that easy...

The man dying on the cross next to Jesus that day May disagree one day when you get to meet him...... once a person receives the Lord they are saved. The rest is up to them and their life will be dictated by choices they make with or without the holy spirits guidance. I know ALLOT of Christians who really are saved but live very distraught lives because their walk is weak and they ignore the spirit and pay the price daily. But I do believe they are indeed saved

[Death from Above]

You can not pick one verse out of the whole bible when it comes to eternity. I wish it were that easy...

Tell that to Jesus...or John....or Paul....Or Peter....or

When you confess with your mouth and believe in your heart....

That belief leads to a conviction that demands change...

Any teaching based on actions (whether moral or not) that provide salvation is unbiblical.

Prove me wrong in the Word and I change my mind

[Pineywoods]

Tell that to Jesus...or John....or Paul....Or Peter....or

When you confess with your mouth and believe in your heart....

That belief leads to a conviction that demands change...

Any teaching based on actions (whether moral or not) that provide salvation is unbiblical.

Prove me wrong in the Word and I change my mind

Correct

[Death from Above]

Correct

And you need to be back teaching in His church

[Pony1971]

IMO

I believe John 3:16 is really simple direction to salvation....whosoever believes in Him (Jesus). To me it comes down to what does it mean to believe. It is an instant thought that becomes reality, you simply know and in that moment you have eternal life. The barrier to Heaven is/was sin. But Jesus paid that price on the cross.

Again IMO -- believing in Jesus for Salvation and nothing else - -and I received the free gift of admission to Heaven. Nothing else I have done could ever earn me that right. I have may ticket to get in. And that is Everlasting life.

However, how I live once I receive the gift, decides how close to Jesus I earn to sit and spend eternity. But, my admission can NEVER be revoked. I have strayed in my walk numerous times, but have never doubted in my final destination. Now, I will have plenty to account for and be judged on when I get there.

Following John 3:16 is various verses that clarify some of the items discussed in this thread. But to me, there is a clear line between salvation and discipleship. Salvation is free, discipleship is following and earning rewards in heaven. Discipleship is not earning the right to go to heaven.

I like to picture things and this is one way I have always pictured it..if going to heaven was a like a concert.

The ticket is free to the concert. I get it be believing and get it instantly. But my seat depends on how I live once I accept the ticket. Jesus is on the center stage. I know won't be on the front row, but many many will have earned that right. Others will be in the first deck, then second deck...then some will be in the cheap seats and standing room only. Everyone will be able to hear and experience the concert, but some will enjoy a more personally relationship and be closer to Jesus.

And yes, there will be people in Heaven that have done terrible things. Unfortunately there will be some not in Heaven that thought they lived good enough to go and earned that right. But sin, is sin, we think some are worse, but it is all sin.

Also, Jesus died on the cross for our sins. He paid it all. If I thought there was more to it than believing.....I would be telling him what he did was not enough. But the truth is, Jesus is the only one that could have done it, and no one gets to the father except thru Jesus. And that gift is free.

Sorry for the long read.

[MadHatter]

The man dying on the cross next to Jesus that day May disagree one day when you get to meet him...... once a person receives the Lord they are saved. The rest is up to them and their life will be dictated by choices they make with or without the holy spirits guidance. I know ALLOT of Christians who really are saved but live very distraught lives because their walk is weak and they ignore the spirit and pay the price daily. But I do believe they are indeed saved

So when it says, if you are lukewarm(weak walk) I will spew you out, what does that mean to you?
Not religious at all but I have to disagree with you.
If that's all it takes to get to heaven, then what's so special about it.
Crazy how nowadays everyone is going to heaven.
Take all these religions, and go back just a few short yrs, and none of them believed like this. Religions keeps morphing to appease an ever increasing secular world imo. That is wrong.
A guy can be the worst sob you ever meet, and soon as he dies the preacher preaches him right into heaven because he believed in Jesus
Even though I care nothing for it, I glad I came from a religious background that toed the line, and never compromised.
When's the last time you went to a funeral and the preacher let everyone know, so and so was in hell?(based off what was known of the individual)
I went to many of em growing up. You didn't like it, go find another religion/preacher.
It says "you will be known..."
Nowadays you can't tell a Christian from any other joe schmoe walking down the street.
Crazy how far its come since the days of John Wesley and the like.

[toomuchsun]

Me: very wise discerning Mother, Brothers and church and other family. Learned about the security of the believer. I believe true. I will never understand or believe security means even with a sincere confession and desire to be saved that one can not turn away and be Forced to go to Heaven. I have a very close one who believes all is a ticket to Heaven because of these teachings. Others Have said they were never saved? Come on, God makes it clear in New and Old testaments that is not so! There are scriptures that are used to promote this but read on. There is massive more of destruction of evil than any free rides. Put them together, no easy feat and see we must allow ourselves to change, "be nice" duh, and recognize evil! Believe and have faith and fruit to show our faith and desire and yes, we will fail but there is a clear path of evil and good. Not really hard to define. And failures will be forgiven! It is so confusing to non beievers due to so much junk out there. I am myself truly confused why God would allow us to continue as we carry on in this world to exist other than I know His love as part of my simple explanation. We are confounded and so much teaching that is for the person or segregated specific beliefs, not for the Church Bride. I am notorious to scientific analyze and ask. People say No that is wrong. I feel God would be scolding me if I did not ask and try to understand and believe me, Science in itself is not what I am talking about. Simple understanding the mysteries and applying if possibel. Also if no answer found, accept some unknowns, open the soul and the Truth will be known. Now Where Did God come from! Ouch, I certainly do not know. I do know not from a big bang. That little piece of ? had to come from somewhere to blow up and define beauty like where I hunt!

[Pineywoods]

And you need to be back teaching in His church

Been praying hard about that. Praying God opens a door to get back to full time ministry. I have felt incomplete these last couple of years since stepping down and realize it was a big mistake. I miss preaching and teaching. I have realized it is who I am not just something I did. Praise God for His grace in being patient with me while I wrestled with that.

[Death from Above]

Been praying hard about that. Praying God opens a door to get back to full time ministry. I have felt incomplete these last couple of years since stepping down and realize it was a big mistake. I miss preaching and teaching. I have realized it is who I am not just something I did. Praise God for His grace in being patient with me while I wrestled with that.

Been in them same shoes. If you want to shop your resume pm me. I know of quite a few churches looking for youth ministers with life & ministry experience.

[toomuchsun]

Need to make one more comment! I believe God is faithful to us! I believe in absolute security becoming part of Gods preparation for eternity with Him. I do not believe in simple one line scripture claims without heart soul directed spirit study to get a grip on where we are headed but do not want my feeling to misdirect anyone wanting to know beauty and peace in their Creator and loving Father. I repect others thoughts and do Not want to complicate the Basics: Jesus died for My sins and I can be forever in bliss with my God and Saviour.

[Pineywoods]

Been in them same shoes. If you want to shop your resume pm me. I know of quite a few churches looking for youth ministers with life & ministry experience.

I appreciate that. After talking with our Lead Pastor, there seems to be a good possibility of a new staff position being added in our church where I served as Youth Pastor before. We have grown like crazy and may be having to go to two services in January due to a lack of parking. I'm praying that God will work that out but most importantly that He leads me where He wants me.

[Saltaholic]

Shocking?

[QUOTE=MadHatter;14453525]quote MadHatter
So when it says, if you are lukewarm(weak walk) I will spew you out, what does that mean to you?

I know exactly what that verse means especially in its original context. My point is once saved there is no losing salvation period. And it’s also never too late to repent and be saved just like the guy on the cross next to Jesus I was referring to who was saved right before dying.

Oh and religion is a totally different topic lol

[Death from Above]

I appreciate that. After talking with our Lead Pastor, there seems to be a good possibility of a new staff position being added in our church where I served as Youth Pastor before. We have grown like crazy and may be having to go to two services in January due to a lack of parking. I'm praying that God will work that out but most importantly that He leads me where He wants me.

[RiverRat1]

So when it says, if you are lukewarm(weak walk) I will spew you out, what does that mean to you?
Not religious at all but I have to disagree with you.
If that's all it takes to get to heaven, then what's so special about it.
Crazy how nowadays everyone is going to heaven.
Take all these religions, and go back just a few short yrs, and none of them believed like this. Religions keeps morphing to appease an ever increasing secular world imo. That is wrong.
A guy can be the worst sob you ever meet, and soon as he dies the preacher preaches him right into heaven because he believed in Jesus
Even though I care nothing for it, I glad I came from a religious background that toed the line, and never compromised.
When's the last time you went to a funeral and the preacher let everyone know, so and so was in hell?(based off what was known of the individual)
I went to many of em growing up. You didn't like it, go find another religion/preacher.
It says "you will be known..."
Nowadays you can't tell a Christian from any other joe schmoe walking down the street.
Crazy how far its come since the days of John Wesley and the like.

One does not need works to get into heaven. If that were the case then how much or what quantity of work?

And yes the worst sob has the chance to go to heaven. All of us were/are bad. You must keep in mind John 3:16 is way more complicated than people make it. On one hand if a person recognizes their sin and truly understands Jesus and accepts him it is that easy. But one can't simply say I accept Jesus so they feel good and then go their merry way.. That is not understanding or really believing..It's just saying words to make themselves feel good.

And they don't preach a person is in hell at funerals because we don't know for sure where the person went.

I personally believe in some form of predestination. I know that freaks out many people just saying that word. If you think about it and believe God knows all (past present and future) it's not that big of a deal. We all deserve hell. So if he opens your ears to hear then you understand. I won't question why/how he chooses. Lots of versus but one is "
Galatians 1:15

"But when God, who had set me apart even from my mother's womb and called me through His grace, was pleased"