What would you do?

[az2tx]

A good friend of mine went on a guide hunt in KS and did not receive what was promised. He sent the owner an email detailing his experience.

The owner replied back stating he would sue him for slander if he talked anymore about his experience.He can sue him but his chances of winning are extremely slim if he is telling the truth. I would tell the outfitter that I'm going to post "Hunt Reports" on every hunting forum I can find.

My friend wrote this up when he got back.

As I have said I probably would have never booked a hunt like this of my own accord. Probably because of the large investment and to many unknowns. Why pay that kind of money for a hunt with no more of a guarantee than my own deer lease? Sure it took me to Kansas and I got some expert advice from folks who know how to hunt there. However some of the exact fears I had in regards to hunting with an outfitter bit me as I suspected.

Realize that these thoughts I am putting down are my opinion and how I perceived how we were treated. The outfitter claims I was imagining things. I will not start a thread slandering this particular outfitter however I am comfortable relaying my feelings within this thread and I will refrain from using their name anymore.

#1 My particular guide was in his 2nd week on the job. WARNING SIGN!!!! We booked this hunt 18 months ago. Why did we get the brand new guy? I will tell you why. Because we were first timers. My brother had informed them we had never used an outfitter.If you would have told them that you had 4 clients you wanted to take hunting, they would have treated you differently There were two other groups on this particular hunt. One of them had a national outdoor writer Bad deal, those guys always get the bestand the other group was all returning customersYou got the lefy overs. We got the short end of the stick. Our guy was a knowledgeable hunter, born and raised in the town where we hunted. He had not been a guide though. Most probably your guide was picked up because the outfitter was overbooked and they needed someone temp to help out.

#2 Because of our guides rookie status I believe we were given the left over properties after the first two groups were placed. All week long we sat at dinner listening to the stories of their kills and all the shooters they passed up while we looked on in amazement since we were rarely seeing any deer, much less shooters. The other guides were long time guides with the outfitter.

#3 The properties we were placed on were new to the outfitter - although we had been told up front that we would be placed on properties that were "hot". Properties that had game cam pics of shooters, testimonials from hunters and intense scouting from the guides. On at least two occasions when I asked what had been seen at the property we were headed to the guide told me they had never been hunted. I asked what kind of pictures they were getting only to be told they didn't have camera out. The very first stand I hunted was a ladder stand that had obviously just gone up. Freshly cut limbs and shiny buckles on the ratchet straps. My guide later admitted that it had gone up the day before we got there. It was not placed using specific scouting info. Just the fact that there was a creek and a trail running beside it.

#4 Although they would never admit it I believe our guide was hired because he was local and had access to many, many properties. We were hunting all these new properties and I believe he was picking them based on their history rather than current scouting. We kept being told of the huge bucks killed on certain properties in years past but he could not tell us what was being seen there lately. Everyone once in a while he would sprinkle in a rumor of a farmer seeing a giant the day before but we just didn't see any deer to speak of.

#5 To validate my feelings, COINCIDENTALLY after I complained on Thursday we finally saw a ton of deer on Friday. We finally got put on a property with some recent scouting info and I saw a lot of deer. However it was pretty obvious I had been placed in a stand intended for the upcoming rifle season as all the deer traffic was 150 yards away near the thin timberline that seperated a crp field from a pond. Anyone with half a brain would quickly figure out where to place that tripod for a bowhunter. Several others in my group had instances of feeling like their blind was set for a gun hunter as well.

So Konk, is that enough info?

My word for the wise in regards to hunting with an outfitter. Be very cautious!!!! Get more information than I did. I pretty much was along for the ride and let my bro work out the details and I should have been more involved. Get specific info on your particular guide up front. Ask questions and make sure you won't have to play second fiddle to other groups. Make sure and get specific scouting information on the exact properties you will be hunting.

My honest opinion is that I was taken advantage of and I won't ever pay an outfitter again. I saved money for 18 months to go up there and NOT see deer. The weather and the moon didn't help but that just goes to show that there are way to many unknowns to make that kind of an investment. Guys like us that have bowhunted for years and years can do it just as well or better on our own.

I may well go back to Kansas but it will not be with an outfitter.


My friend is going to send me his response later on today.

I have been on many guided hunts all over the world and have had a few bad ones where the outfitter and I had a difference opinion. The last thing the outfitter wants is for people to hear about your bad experience.
I would write up an accurate and honest hunt report and email it to the outfitter along with a complete list of where you plan to post it. I would slo tell him that I wanted my money back. If he starts threatening slander, just ask him"for telling the truth?"

FYI I had an outfitter meet me at SCI opening morning to give me a bank check for 25K over a deal like this, because he didn't want me to have a hot babe running around the convention handing out flyers telling what happened.

[BIG BONE]

sry to hear that

[dbaio1]

Sorry to hear this. I will share my experiences with legal matters I have had, not hunting related. But I can tell you one thing, once lawyers are involved the "i believe" loses every single to the facts that can be proven. Just have him be careful of his wording and get it off a public forum is legal proceeds are sought.

Good luck to your friend. I have had few run in's with lousy outfitters but each time it was my own fault for not doing my due diligence ahead of time.

[Chuy]

I have been on many guided hunts all over the world and have had a few bad ones where the outfitter and I had a difference opinion. The last thing the outfitter wants is for people to hear about your bad experience.
I would write up an accurate and honest hunt report and email it to the outfitter along with a complete list of where you plan to post it. I would slo tell him that I wanted my money back. If he starts threatening slander, just ask him"for telling the truth?"

FYI I had an outfitter meet me at SCI opening morning to give me a bank check for 25K over a deal like this, because he didn't want me to have a hot babe running around the convention handing out flyers telling what happened.

THIS!

It is NOT slander if you are telling the truth. Slander relates to falsifying facts to hurt someones image/reputation. Simply stating your experiences with the outfitter is just that, a REVIEW.

The main reason outfitters even have a client base if from....you guessed it, REVIEWS and word of mouth.

I would just as he said, write a good, unbiased review on your experiences, including the terrible customer service, with a copy of the email attached, and send it back to the owner, stating that you will submitting this review to the following places......

Then, I would give a few definitions on the word "sland" and "libel" and justify why your review is not such.

FOllow through with what you say.

Report to BBB.

[elliscountyhog]

I had the same experience in kansas the last two years with diffrent outfitters. Pay almost $3k plus license and etc. Expecting that when i show up to hunt there would be trail cam pics of the deer and stands on trails and deer somewhat patterned and the "Guide" to feel it is a good spot and i would SEE deer. Then to get there and have single ladder stands scattered throughout and then ask him any good deer on cam around this area and the answer be " I dunno i have been in here since august". And as he shows us the farm and then venture off to say "Yall will have to just get a feel for the deer and set up on them" So basically i paid for a kansas "Lease" for a week on 200acre farm that i prolly could have "Leased" myself for a whole season and not just a week. However it was a nice place and would have loved to have had another week to hunt we were just starting to figure the deer out.

[youngbuc]

He should contact the outdoor writer that was in camp with him. Get him to write a truthful article about it.

[6.5x284]

The archery rut begins in unit11 ks the second week of november. I haved hunted that unit for 11yrs. In the last 4yrs we have arrowed 2 deer over 170. there is a lot of free hunting and walk in hunting. over 6000acrs the mined land at weir ks. give me a hollar

[Flint knapper]

I'd tell the outfitter to go ahead and give it your best shot!!!

[Puggy625]

Tell the outfitter that you either want a refund or a REDUCED hunt next year. If neither one is offered, tell him to pound sand and unleash the hounds of hell with an honest review on every site possible. That's just what I would do......

[XC450]

That sucks to hear a bad experience like this, especially after saving for 18 months for what should have been a trip of a lifetime! I would be pushing hard on the outfitter!

[Atfulldraw]

ask him if he knows what a counterclaim is.....

saves you the trouble of looking him up and finding him for service of process

[Ron]

Unfortunately I've had the same experience and to say that it sucks, is a understatement.

[Texanhunter]

It's not slander, it was his experience, it would also be nice to know who it was so no one else on here makes the same mistake. If he was told he would be located in areas that were scouted and deer were moving that's what I would expect. This is not what he got. I would post it and say bring it on. Can't sue for slander if it's the truth.

Slander..lol. So when people give reviews of their experiences, if it's not positive it's slander? Man I post as much info as I could, hoping no one else loses any more money with the jerk. Sorry to hear about your experience, and hope you get at least a partial refund. That would suck, getting all hyped up about the trip, hunt etc, and then this happens.