Best 12 Ga. Defensive Load?

[spencorLUK]

if you shoot someone with bird shot in the face close there gonna go down think about it, another birdshot vote

[DorothyNotKeegan]

Compressed zinc. It is powder compressed into a shotgun shell. The powder will knock the door off the hinges. We used to use these to breach door on SRT. There isn't a projectile in which you have to be concerned about blowing through your wall and into the neighbors house. Do a search on these. Another nice but expensive round are the flash bang shotgun rounds. They won't explode on a window as it takes something hard to make them explode. We used them to shoot into the upstairs windows to distract the suspects as we busted in the front door!

[Take em]

High brass #4's are bad dudes. I've killed hogs and deer with #6's at 20 yards. A human doesn't stand a chance

I don't know if I wold admit to shooting deer with #6's. LEO will not be to happy.

[DorothyNotKeegan]

High brass #4's are bad dudes. I've killed hogs and deer with #6's at 20 yards. A human doesn't stand a chance

[mjhaverkamp]

if you shoot someone with bird shot in the face close there gonna go down think about it, another birdshot vote

That is true but I am not going to let a guy get in my face if I have the choice, I have shot a pig before with bird shot at very close range, by the time we had the pig down we had emptied about 15 rounds or so in him, I know a pig is not a person, just saying.

[TexasBob]

High brass #4's are bad dudes. I've killed hogs and deer with #6's at 20 yards. A human doesn't stand a chance

This. #4 Long Brass for me. I dont think any human could take two or 3 of those center mass and keep coming. On the off chance they do, should stun them enough for me to gain composure and aim the .45.

[Mike D]

This. #4 Long Brass for me. I dont think any human could take two or 3 of those center mass and keep coming. On the off chance they do, should stun them enough for me to gain composure and aim the .45.

You wouldn't think a person could take 22 rounds from a 40 caliber either, but I just read an article the other day in a police officer magazine that an officer got into a gun fight with a perp that took 22 rounds of 40 S&W before finally dying. Autopsy did not reveal any drugs or alcohol in his system at all. It is pretty amazing what a human can take when pumped on adrenaline much less if they are strung out on drugs or something else.

The object is not to see how many times they need to be shot, it is to stop them preferably with the first one. Plus, I don't want to be ripping off multiple rounds of anything inside my house.

And the only reason to give up a 12 gauge in favor of a 45 is if you are out of ammo or the shotgun malfunctions.

Clint Smith's philosophy has a lot of merit.

You use your pistol to fight your way to your shotgun to fight your way to your rifle.

[Tilladaddy]

This is a fun debate. If the special forces use 00Buck then that is what I am going to use. No need to see how they are doing later.

[AtTheWall]

I don't see any LE, military or anyone else for that matter using bird shot. If it was that great they would be using it.

US Customs uses 8 shot. I know, during my years in the Coast Guard they carried this for shipboard sweeps. Steel ships are dangerous with bullets or buckshot with the projectile ricocheting around without control. Birdshot will take down the average person in an average sized room 20x20 without worry of carrying energy beyond via ricochet and nailing someone or something else that isn't targeted. Birdshot in steel rooms, you can shoot the deck or wall and this round will follow parallel to that surface till it impacts the far side. Thugs shooting around a corner, simply aim at the wall between you and them, angle shot at head level, shot will hit wall and then fly along the wall just inches above covering the corner nicely..potentially blinding the shooter and nailing his shooting hand. You don't need a tight aim to pull this one off and a high capacity shotgun with multiple shots...thats a lot of nasty going down range.

[Bill]

My issue with bird shot is IF you know the 1st shot will be at a short distance and the shot will still be in the wad and acting like a slug, that's one idea. However, it's possible that the perp will be at a longer distance and the shot will leave the wad, then you will not kill on the first shot, and the perp can shoot back at you (or me).

I have 3 00 buck followed by 2, 12 gauge slugs. I figure if he's not down after 3 blasts of 00 he's behind a wall somewhere, and I want to be able to play hide-and-seek with him through the wall.

Most important, is fire the last round into the ceiling or a safe place, and then claim it was your "warning shot and he kept coming at me saying he'd kill me". One other piece of advise given to me was while waiting for the police to respond, bend over and give the hardest abdominal squeeze you can to mess your pants. Then the police officer can say if it goes to court, "the man was so scared, he **** in his pants"

[Maddox]

00 Buckshot is like putting 8 9mm rounds into him. Grab your shotgun, get a tight choke, and load it with 00 buckshot.

[DorothyNotKeegan]

US Customs uses 8 shot. I know, during my years in the Coast Guard they carried this for shipboard sweeps. Steel ships are dangerous with bullets or buckshot with the projectile ricocheting around without control. Birdshot will take down the average person in an average sized room 20x20 without worry of carrying energy beyond via ricochet and nailing someone or something else that isn't targeted. Birdshot in steel rooms, you can shoot the deck or wall and this round will follow parallel to that surface till it impacts the far side. Thugs shooting around a corner, simply aim at the wall between you and them, angle shot at head level, shot will hit wall and then fly along the wall just inches above covering the corner nicely..potentially blinding the shooter and nailing his shooting hand. You don't need a tight aim to pull this one off and a high capacity shotgun with multiple shots...thats a lot of nasty going down range.

I would have to disagree with US Customs using 8 shot unless it's something new. We (US Customs) use 00 buck and slugs. I prefer buckshot over the slugs.

[Russ81]

Birdshot in the house and I aim for the head and neck. Blind them if they stare and survive but I bet that full choke cylinder will put enough lead into the zone to make me call a professional cleaning service to mop and pick the pieces up afterwards. If I need a double tap, gut shot is next.

If I shoot bird loads its either going to be in the head/upper chest or a few in the ***** to give him motivation to take it on down the road. AND if I don't kill him no lawsuit!!!

[Outbreaker]

I have kileld over 15 pigs with 7.5 bird shot all head shots at ranges from inches to 7yds.

All dropped in their tracks. That is what I use at the house as well.

[Redneck Archer]

I use 3" 00 buck or slug... or my 44... whichever one is more convenient in the situation...