Anybody ever built their own safe/vault door?

[wes122984]

our bank vault doors are pretty simple. 1/2" -1" plate.

[txfireguy2003]

Yeah, the door part is simple, it's the locking mechanism that gets tricky.

[gonehuntin]

Mag Locks are a great choice along with a battery backup for home built safedoor/room. They do work, have seen a couple of safe rooms built into a paneled walls that you could not ever tell where the opening was. They are some of the easiest locks to install.

[Talon]

The Mag lock idea is pure genius! we have them on some door at the office work and they work great! You got my mine a turning now!!!! Thanks for the share!

[Avezorak]

I really like the idea of the mag locks as a way to keep my vault door hidden. Got the wheels turning

[txfireguy2003]

I'm thinking on it, the main concern I have is the requirement for electricity for them to work. As in, without power, they unlock. I guess a battery backup would work though. There are several systems available from 600lb holding force to over 2000lbs, but I still think a mechanical lock of some sort is stronger and more reliable.

[Draco]

No, with out electricity, they are locked. The magnet isn't the lock. It is a solenoid so has a bolt that retracts when energized. No electricity and the bolt just drops out by a light spring. That is why the top one is in the frame where the bolt drops into a hole in the door. The bottom one is built into the door so it can drop into the frame.

[Mike D]

I can't help you with the locking mechanism but what I can say is don't use Sheetrock for your fire protection, use a real fire insulation like the mineral wool used in high temperature industrial ovens.

Coincidentally have you called sturdy safe and asked them about their vault doors?

[txfireguy2003]

I haven't called sturdy safe, never heard of them actually. As far as the fire proof insulation, I'd find the right stuff, but you might find this interesting:

In the fire service, we deal with five "types" of construction. We'll deal with only the first two here, they are Type 1 "fire resistive" and Type 2 which is "non-combustible". As you go down the scale to type 5, the level of fire resistance decreases. So, it was always strange to me that a "fire resistive" building had a higher rating than "non-combustible". The reason for that, is that steel frames, concrete structures etc are "non-combustible" meaning they won't burn, but they will still fail eventually....sometimes pretty fast too. A "Fire Resistive" building on the other hand, must be constructed of non-combustible materials, but then those materials must also be protected. One of the most common forms of protection is simply wrapping the structural components with sheetrock. The sheetrock insulates the non-combustible frame of the building and protects it for a specified period based on ratings, which are usually in the neighborhood of several hours.

[bearkat2004]

for the industrial buildings we build at work, we use 2 5/8" sheets of sheetrock to meet a 2 hour fire rating per UL...

[txfireguy2003]

Right, so I was thinking a 1/4" plate face
with stiffening bars welded on the back, some sheetrock or other material, and another plate on the back side to make a sandwich about 1.5" thick or so. On the back of that second plate, attach some sort of locking mechanism to lock the thing closed and call it good.

[Mike D]

I haven't called sturdy safe, never heard of them actually. As far as the fire proof insulation, I'd find the right stuff, but you might find this interesting:

In the fire service, we deal with five "types" of construction. We'll deal with only the first two here, they are Type 1 "fire resistive" and Type 2 which is "non-combustible". As you go down the scale to type 5, the level of fire resistance decreases. So, it was always strange to me that a "fire resistive" building had a higher rating than "non-combustible". The reason for that, is that steel frames, concrete structures etc are "non-combustible" meaning they won't burn, but they will still fail eventually....sometimes pretty fast too. A "Fire Resistive" building on the other hand, must be constructed of non-combustible materials, but then those materials must also be protected. One of the most common forms of protection is simply wrapping the structural components with sheetrock. The sheetrock insulates the non-combustible frame of the building and protects it for a specified period based on ratings, which are usually in the neighborhood of several hours.

Luke I do commercial construction for a living. Sheetrock does provide some protection but in the heat of a fire it breaks down quickly.

The insulation I am talking about provides far superior fire/heat rejection properties.

You can have industrial oven running at extremely high temps and walk up to the insulated wall panels and touch them and they are cool to the touch.

Take a look around their site and see what you think. I think their door will be well outside what you are wanting to pay but you may be able to gain some info that may help you in your application.

[txfireguy2003]

Luke I do commercial construction for a living. Sheetrock does provide some protection but in the heat of a fire it breaks down quickly.

The insulation I am talking about provides far superior fire/heat rejection properties.

You can have industrial oven running at extremely high temps and walk up to the insulated wall panels and touch them and they are cool to the touch.

Take a look around their site and see what you think. I think their door will be well outside what you are wanting to pay but you may be able to gain some info that may help you in your application.

Appreciate it Mike, didn't know what you did for a living, good to know. So you're recommending rock wool? I also saw a video from a safe manufacturer, AmSec maybe, that used a poured insulation. They called it fire clay, but said it was basically cement, diatomaceous earth (DE powder is available at any pool supply store) and vermiculite which is a gardening product to hold moisture. Any experience with that stuff? They said they oven cured it, but if it's got cement in it, I'm wondering if the oven is just to speed up the cure time for higher production volume.

[Mike D]

Anybody ever built their own safe/vault door?

Appreciate it Mike, didn't know what you did for a living, good to know. So you're recommending rock wool? I also saw a video from a safe manufacturer, AmSec maybe, that used a poured insulation. They called it fire clay, but said it was basically cement, diatomaceous earth (DE powder is available at any pool supply store) and vermiculite which is a gardening product to hold moisture. Any experience with that stuff? They said they oven cured it, but if it's got cement in it, I'm wondering if the oven is just to speed up the cure time for higher production volume.

IMO yes Luke a rock wool/fibrous ceramic would be the better route to go.

The negative I've heard about the material AMSEC uses is that it will actually absorb heat and retain it for a long time making the internal temp in your safe actually higher for a longer period of time. Granted it would have to be a fire that burns hot for a longer period but once it reaches a saturation point it takes a long time to cool down. In addition the weight of something like that becomes burdensome quickly.

The real goal of a fire liner in a safe is to keep the internal temp of the safe to a level where damage will not occur to the contents.

I really would encourage you to look around on his site and even call them. He's usually more than happy to answer any questions you might have. I talked with him for nearly 2 hours when I called him, lol.

[txfireguy2003]

Wow, I'll have to give him a call then. The way I understood the AmSec material was that basically, DE and Vermiculite retain water (in fact, I think they are used in home made forges for blacksmithing). Basically the way I understood it was that as the material heats up, it really can't get above the boiling point of water until all of the water had converted to stream and boiled off. While 212 degrees is hot, it's way better than 1000 plus, and documents, wood, many plastics even, aren't damaged by even extended stays in 200ish degree temps.