Danno's Religious Questions

[LWC]

I was being serious.

Don’t make me wash your mouth out with soap!

Yes ma'am. I apologize

[Death from Above]

So JESUS isn’t the only way? A person isolated from the gospel can enter heaven a sinful person having never confessed their sinful nature or calling upon the name of the lord to save them, all based on how they lived on earth? Is that what you said? Can you back that up with scripture?

Noone is going to have an excuse. All are guilty and need saving.

Romans 1 theology.

We must not put God in a box and then try and understand Scripture that way. It is a bad hermeneutic and always leads to sketchy theology.

The bible is an instruction for us on how we can relate to God in an individual capacity. Once we accept that and allow Him to do that life change we develop the proper perspective on how to treat our neighbors. Loving God always comes 1st.

Great probing question

[AZ&F'sDaddy]

So JESUS isn’t the only way? A person isolated from the gospel can enter heaven a sinful person having never confessed their sinful nature or calling upon the name of the lord to save them, all based on how they lived on earth? Is that what you said? Can you back that up with scripture?

Good questions! Jesus IS the only way. Even for those who are saved despite the fact that they never had the opportunity to hear about Jesus in this phase of their existence.
Romans 2: There were those that had received no special covenant or Torah revelation but who nevertheless lived out the kind of things the Torah called for. That being the case, said Paul, they became a Torah unto themselves (2:14). He isn't talking about Israel's Tabernacle, sacrificial and festal system. Passover, deliverance from Egypt and such things are peculiar to those who experienced them; they bear witness to historical events that only Israel experienced. Paul clearly has in mind moral and ethical uprightness (2:7). Yes, but how would the Gentiles come to know such things? I'll pass by comment on that. The truth is clear enough about the kind of thing they would be expected to live out. Paul painted the Gentile world in general terms in Romans 1:18-32. If you didn't read chapter 2 you might think there wasn't a single Gentile in all creation that cared a fig for goodness. He gives a non-exhaustive list of their crimes. Not only did they sin these sins expressed the moral darkness of their hearts, they knew that those that lived that way deserved death (1:32). Where did they come up with all that knowledge? They didn't get it from looking at the stars and reasoning to it. There's only so much you can get out of the "cosmological argument". So where did they get it from? Was it written in their genes? However we answer the question about the source of their knowledge—the bulk of the Gentile world suppressed the truth (1:18) and refused to be led in thankfulness to honor God in their lives. But there were those who took such truth seriously and though they were sinners in need of forgiveness—only Jesus is Jesus—they patiently continued in doing good, seeking the higher life. They shared the knowledge that was there in the Gentile world, the same knowledge the rest of their people had, but they lived up to it. The "special revelation" about moral truth and righteousness was not the exclusive property of a few Gentiles—it was open to them all and the masses wanted nothing to do with it. But for those who did want something to do with it—could they have life with God in the forgiveness of sins and the hope of better? Paul says yes! And I read Romans 2:6-16 as saying just that kind of thing.

This is a complex question and one worth pursuing. Ultimately, it's a theological question: What is God like? Is he a God who would automatically reject someone simply because they never had an opportunity to hear? The God I read about in the Holy Scriptures is not like that. God will judge rightly.

By the way, none of what I have said has anything to do with earning salvation. No one earns salvation.

[AZ&F'sDaddy]

Here's some scripture for you guys that think God isn't going to judge people "who never heard about Him".
Romans1:18-21
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. 19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.

We got caught up in people needing to be taught about God. Like He needs us to save people for Him!! His spirit does His work and will reveal himself to the people He chose from the beginning of time. God is going to win no matter what you and I think or say! Job is the best book to help us understand who God is and what He's all about.

Romans 8:29-30

29For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters; 30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.

The God I read of in the Holy Scriptures does not create anyone, predetermining that they will be condemned to everlasting punishment, without giving them a choice in the matter. Such a god would be a monster and not worth talking about. We cannot call tyranny and sadism "glorious" even if it should happen to be "divine" tyranny and sadism. God has spoken of the death of the unrighteous and says he finds no pleasure in it (Ezekiel 18:23,32). His "glory" involves his love for the whole world (John 3:16-17) for whom he sent Christ as a sacrificial offering (1 John 2:2).

[Death from Above]

We got caught up in people needing to be taught about God. Like He needs us to save people for Him!! His spirit does His work and will reveal himself to the people He chose from the beginning of time. God is going to win no matter what you and I think or say! Job is the best book to help us understand who God is and what He's all about.

.

This completely contrary to the life and teachings of Jesus.

The Great Commission?

We don't save people but we (His Church) is the resource/tool that He ahs chosen to propagate His Truth t the Word.


A Christian that does not share the Good News is not an obedient on.

[SaltwaterSlick]

Hey Danno,
One other thing occurred to me that I think might help you in your search and study. A couple years ago, our church did a program of Bible study using a chronological Bible and it was a year long program of reading through the Bible, but the Bible we used was a chronological bible... As you probably have figured out, the Bible as some refer to it is a series of "short stories" that is not on a time line outline... Genesis, being the first book in the Bible is the beginning, but from there on, the various "Books" of the bible bounce around all over the place with respect to the time period in which the events written about actually occurred. A chronological Bible takes every verse in the Bible and arranges them in as best as can be determined (some Books/events are unclear as to the "when" that the occurred) in the order in which they occurred. I participated in the program and indeed did read through the Bible chronologically and it did more for my understanding of the Story of God (which is what the Bible is) than any single thing I've ever done.


I'd love for you to have a copy of a chronological Bible to read. If you will PM me an email or cell phone number, I will gift you one off Amazon.



This is the one I use and it is a modern translation that reads easy. It is the New King James Version and every verse that is in the 66 canonized Books of the Bible are in this Bible.

https://www.amazon.com/One-Year-Chronological-Bible-NKJV-ebook/dp/B007V698PY/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1626962365&sr=8-3

If you'd rather have a hard copy, PM me an address and I'll mail it to you.

[c3products20]

The God I read of in the Holy Scriptures does not create anyone, predetermining that they will be condemned to everlasting punishment, without giving them a choice in the matter. Such a god would be a monster and not worth talking about. We cannot call tyranny and sadism "glorious" even if it should happen to be "divine" tyranny and sadism. God has spoken of the death of the unrighteous and says he finds no pleasure in it (Ezekiel 18:23,32). His "glory" involves his love for the whole world (John 3:16-17) for whom he sent Christ as a sacrificial offering (1 John 2:2).

Here's one possible answer to your questions. God is omnipresent meaning he's at the end and the beginning at the "same time". He knew if we would choose Him before He created the world.
Psalm 139:16
Your eyes saw my unformed body;
all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.

If He knows our choices and what we are going to choose He wouldn't be predetermining us to destruction it would still be our choice. He just knew what our choice was before He created us.

[AZ&F'sDaddy]

Here's one possible answer to your questions. God is omnipresent meaning he's at the end and the beginning at the "same time". He knew if we would choose Him before He created the world.
Psalm 139:16
Your eyes saw my unformed body;
all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.

If He knows our choices and what we are going to choose He wouldn't be predertimining us to destruction it would still be our choice. He just knew what our choice was before He created us.

It wouldn't be so bad if Calvin allowed us to believe that God destined billions for eternal torture on the basis of what he foresaw them doing; if he had, so to speak, "looked ahead" and seen that these billions would freely choose terrible wickedness and in light of that he pronounced them ****ed to eternal torture. Not a bit of it! Calvin won't allow that. Calvin says, "If God merely foresaw human events, and did not arrange and dispose of them as his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment."

[c3products20]

This completely contrary to the life and teachings of Jesus.



The Great Commission?



We don't save people but we (His Church) is the resource/tool that He ahs chosen to propagate His Truth t the Word.





A Christian that does not share the Good News is not an obedient on.

Of course we are called to teach/preach the word but it's not our job to save anyone. Only God can do that!

I'm fairly certain that the best way, possibly the only way, a person can impact the lives of others is by actually living the Word of God. Not just saying it but actually having the Word come out of us through our actions. More damage has been done by people "teaching" The Bible but living like hell. Kids are the best teachers of this. They see right through our shenanigans of saying one thing and doing another!

But God is spirit. We have a spirit, that spirit lives for eternity. There's people in China who speak chinese. They get a page of the Bible, in English, and they can't understand a word of it but they are impacted by it. Why/how? It's God's word and His spirit draws people to Him. We are merely a vessel for Him to use to spread the Gospel.
Matthew 10:39
He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

This is what "dyeing" to self refers to. Giving up our will so we can do God's will. Like Jesus prayed in the garden. Not my will but yours be done.

John 4:24
God is spirit,and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

[SaltwaterSlick]

You know, C3 and DfA, these theological arguments that tend to break out in threads like this are the kind of things that just kill it for those who are searching for answers as a new Christian, or a person who is trying to understand and grasp who and what God is! If you guys want to argue about that sort of stuff, please go start your own thread and don't derail this one..
Good Grief!

[c3products20]

You know, C3 and DfA, these theological arguments that tend to break out in threads like this are the kind of things that just kill it for those who are searching for answers as a new Christian, or a person who is trying to understand and grasp who and what God is! If you guys want to argue about that sort of stuff, please go start your own thread and don't derail this one..
Good Grief!

I'm not arguing. I'm having a discussion on an internet discussion board/forum. That's what we do here, we discuss things. Religion is a sticky subject for people because its extremely personal. We have all had experiences with God that only we understand. Because that's who God is! He's a personal God. He know's what each of us needs in order to grow closer to Him. My experience and opinion/interpretation may be different than yours but that's ok. The English language does a poor job of transposing the original meanings of a lot of the words/phrases in the original Bible. But that's ok also. Becuase how many times have you read a line of scripture and it meant something totally different than it did the last time you read it? Because God's Word is alive! Sorry if I came off as arguing but I enjoy discussion on God and the Bible. It's way better than another Covid thread!!!!!

[WItoTX]

You know, C3 and DfA, these theological arguments that tend to break out in threads like this are the kind of things that just kill it for those who are searching for answers as a new Christian, or a person who is trying to understand and grasp who and what God is! If you guys want to argue about that sort of stuff, please go start your own thread and don't derail this one..
Good Grief!

I am glad to see you are back. Thanks for the posts on this thread. I may or may not share your thoughts a bits of the Bible, but reading your opinions with an open mind, and challenging my own thoughts, is one of the things I looked forward to most with your posts.

Thanks!

[trhunter]

Great thread Danno. I can see where some of his questions come from. I was what I would consider a really firm believer in Christ up until my mom past away of cancer (as many other have). After that I start to question why God lets bad things happen to good people and then leaves the scum of the earth here to live. Yea I get the same old same old answers, Like God needed her more that we did and and things like that. But why? Not one person or my readings can answer that. So I can really see where Danno is coming from. My faith is pretty much shattered, so I just don't think about it any longer, and now this thread brings some much of that back. But it is such a good thread. Thanks,

[rolylane6]

Of course we are called to teach/preach the word but it's not our job to save anyone. Only God can do that!

I'm fairly certain that the best way, possibly the only way, a person can impact the lives of others is by actually living the Word of God. Not just saying it but actually having the Word come out of us through our actions. More damage has been done by people "teaching" The Bible but living like hell. Kids are the best teachers of this. They see right through our shenanigans of saying one thing and doing another!

Straight from scripture!

James 2:14-26

New King James Version

Faith Without Works Is Dead(A)

14 (B)What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 (C)If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and (D)one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” (E)Show me your faith without [a]your works, (F)and I will show you my faith by [b]my works. 19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is [c]dead? 21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works (G)when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see (H)that faith was working together with his works, and by (I)works faith was made [d]perfect? 23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, (J)“Abraham believed God, and it was [e]accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called (K)the friend of God. 24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise, (L)was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.




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[Voodoo]

I’m always amazed at any outdoor types that haven’t noticed God.