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Constitutionality of DOGE

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    Constitutionality of DOGE

    A friend of mine, a life long conservative, who voted for Trump expressed that DOGE presents a constitutional crisis. What they argued is this.
    We have an unelected private citizen who is not an appointee to any valid governmental agency or federal executive department (creating doge a federal executive department would require an act of congress) gaining access to sensitive government data, including the private information of federal employees and American citizens without proper authorization or credentialing. There is no congressional oversight of his appointment because doge is not an actual thing.

    The unconstitutional part is treating doge and its "employees" as a federal executive agency and giving it all of the access to the multiple federal departments without the oversight of congress. This effectively thumbs its nose at the balance of powers and sets a dangerous precedent. It is incumbent upon the coequal branches of government to check the executive branch at this point which has asserted power outside of its constitutional authority by creating an agency that functions and a federal agency without having been properly created, approved, and vetted by the congress.​

    This would be like Obama deciding that Van Jones is the best guy to go combing through all of the government data and information with zero oversight or advice and consent from congress. We have three co-equal branches of government to prevent such an abuse, and at no point do we have the luxury of concluding that the ends justify the means.

    while agree with the purpose of DOGE in principle, I think the constitutional validity is questionable and I can see this being problematic in the future. But I also don’t think Congress will ever approve a deep dive into bureaucratic waste because Congress has its hands in the cookie jar, so anyone approved to look is going to be someone on a tight leash in Congress’ hands


    #2
    Constitutionally speaking, your friend may be right. Personally, I know, and you know, that our elected officials are crooked as hell and I would be in favor of anything or anybody that can get the job done.

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      #3
      Im not a big fan of Elon, I dont trust that weirdo at all. That said he was appointed by the President to find my money and he seems to be doing it. Im no scholar of the constitution but I dont think you need to be elected to be appointed to find where money is going. If he was firing people or something like that it may be different. Seems almost like hiring a consultant or appointing a special counsel.

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        #4
        My question is this, why does anyone have an issue with combing through publicly available information on where tax money is being sent by rogue money laundering federal departments that have zero oversight?

        You've had soro's and bloomberg, among others, pulling the levers of federal government for years and nobody says a word, but now a private citizen who answers to the president is auditing the federal agencies and reporting to the president so he can make his own decisions and its a problem? All the talking points of Elon running the government and whatever else are just msm spin no different than russia russia russia and every other propaganda campaign.

        Maybe if all elected officials did their job and weren't taking 10% for the big guy you wouldn't have these issues? Heck they throw these 1800 page bills on the floor to be voted on in 2 hours littered with a million going to some pet project for whichever rep or senator, or 50 million for condom distribution in gaza... somebody has to go through all the government bloat and waste. DOGE answers to the president and it's up to him to do away with or keep funding.

        Lastly, DOGE isn't part of any of the government, all they are is an auditor or consultant. ​

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          #5
          DOGE is being used by legally appointed individuals. For example, Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent directed officials to turn over passwords to DOGE. So it's working at the direction of the Secretary, who was approved by the Senate. It's no different than the massive pile of unelected officially getting the boot these last two weeks because of DOGE.

          That is my redneck view and I reserve the right to change my opinion.

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            #6
            Simple fix: move DOGE under the Office of Management and Budget.

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              #7
              I see no problem gathering the information and making the suggestion of what needs to be cut being a constitution problem. The problem will be when they actually try to cut the spending that the congress has approved.

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                #8
                I think he is looking at it wrong. No one is digging into "private" information, that I have read. They work for us We are the government. There's to much of this "The Government", no such thing. We are the government. We decide who gets to oversee our countries inner workings then they hire and or appoint these people. Do not always agree on who they are or what they are up too but that's how it works. Where our tax money goes should be on the front page Every single time it is spent. No more sneaky bull****! All Musk has been ask to do is show us where it is being spent and how. He is a tech guy but also a business guy who knows how and where to look for expenses to make cuts.

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                  #9
                  I'm sure there's merit to those concerns. But it's also a fact that 90% of what every part of the federal government is currently doing is not constitutional. So whatever can be done to reign that corrupt beast in, I'm for.

                  I don't love executive orders either. They've become far to common. They're also easily undone, so everything that Trump has been doing that we are all cheering right now will be undone as soon as the next Democrat gets elected. And half of it may get undone as soon as the next Republican gets elected. I wish the Republicans in Congress would solidify most of these changes by passing them into law. That can be undone by a future Congress too, but that's harder to do than just another EO from the next president.

                  I really wish that we'd see a few of the major reforms made permanent through constitutional amendments in a convention of the states. That movement has been gaining traction slowly over the last few years. I hope we finally get there soon. It's probably a pipe dream, but the appetite for making permanent reforms is high right now.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by East6101 View Post
                    I think he is looking at it wrong. No one is digging into "private" information, that I have read. They work for us We are the government. There's to much of this "The Government", no such thing. We are the government. We decide who gets to oversee our countries inner workings then they hire and or appoint these people. Do not always agree on who they are or what they are up too but that's how it works. Where our tax money goes should be on the front page Every single time it is spent. No more sneaky bull****! All Musk has been ask to do is show us where it is being spent and how. He is a tech guy but also a business guy who knows how and where to look for expenses to make cuts.
                    I'm leaning towards this camp. Isn't all of this information available to the public? If not, why not!!!?

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                      #11
                      If there was a sniff of DOGE bein unconstitutional it would have already been challenged.....right now they are all in CYA mode and probably ratting out each other....

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                        #12
                        Originally posted by friscopaint View Post
                        If there was a sniff of DOGE bein unconstitutional it would have already been challenged.....right now they are all in CYA mode and probably ratting out each other....
                        Or they are waiting for their turn since that door has again been opened. We all know they are good at playing the long game.

                        Remember, ( as an old coworker used to say ) "ain't no fun when the rabbits got the gun"

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                          #13
                          If your friend was right then I freaking want EVERY pos that gets money from USAID and every decision maker in Washington to be an elected official.

                          Stupid to only point out Elon. And he's literally the only one doing good. So I really don't care even if it is unconstitutional. Democrats told me the last 4 years the constitution wasn't valid anymore anyway.

                          And LMFAO at " sensitive government data" IOW how we steal taxpayer money.

                          Also, if they do end up saying it's unconstitutional hopefully it will be in 3.5 years AFTER they root out all the corruption.


                          Go Elon!
                          Last edited by RiverRat1; 02-04-2025, 04:44 PM.

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                            #14
                            I would rather Elon look at my private info vs the thieves at DOGE that already have.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by RiverRat1 View Post
                              If your friend was right then I freaking want EVERY pos that gets money from USAID and every decision maker in Washington to be an elected official.

                              Stupid to only point out Elon. And he's literally the only one doing good. So I really don't care even if it is unconstitutional. Democrats told me the last 4 years the constitution wasn't valid anymore anyway.

                              And LMFAO at " sensitive government data" IOW how we steal taxpayer money.

                              Also, if they do end up saying it's unconstitutional hopefully it will be in 3.5 years AFTER they root out all the corruption.


                              Go Elon!
                              Lol. You don't have to tell us you don't care if something's unconstitutional. We already know. ​​​​​

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