Non-CHL Holder Question

[dustoffer]

The thread about txmuleyman's intervention to help the Bastrop deputy got me to thinking. I don't have my CHL but most of the time am carrying either rifle, pistol or shotgun in my truck. So--what's the liability for me if I encounter the same situation, grab my gun, step out of my truck, and do what our GS brother did?

[Kurdawg]

I would think with rifle or shotgun you would be fine. With pistol you'd still be ok if you were traveling.

[coker737]

Reason you don't want a CHL?

[texan4ut]

Long gun you are good for sure as right to carry with no license. Handgun illegal outside of your truck. However you are trying to help a Leo I don't think a DA in the state of Texas would prosecute. Libtard states maybe not Texas

[wsteffen]

Get your CHL and don't ask.

[Drycreek3189]

Long gun you are good for sure as right to carry with no license. Handgun illegal outside of your truck. However you are trying to help a Leo I don't think a DA in the state of Texas would prosecute. Libtard states maybe not Texas

I would say this is right. I carried a handgun on my person and in my truck long before it was legal to do so, and I would not have hesitated to defend my life or that of someone else if I thought it was the right thing to do.

[tvc184]

The thread about txmuleyman's intervention to help the Bastrop deputy got me to thinking. I don't have my CHL but most of the time am carrying either rifle, pistol or shotgun in my truck. So--what's the liability for me if I encounter the same situation, grab my gun, step out of my truck, and do what our GS brother did?

I'll bet that I have heard this question in some form about 100 times over the years. "What if I have a gun and I ......?" In fact I asked the same question of an officer about a year before I became one. What if I see an armed robbery and I.....

I have heard all kinds of answers from it is totally legal to it is murder if you have an "unlawful" weapon in your possession and you kill someone.

In truth you have to take each situation or fact of the case separately.

One issue is the use of force and is it justified under the law. The other issue is whether the weapon possessed lawfully. One does not negate or justify the other.

If you lawfully defend yourself or another person then you are okay in that situation. Then comes the issue of possession of the weapon in the first place. If you unlawfully possessed the weapon then you could be charged with that possession but not with the use of force since that was lawful.

It would be prosecutorial discretion on whether to bring that possession charge or not but illegal possession does not negate self defense or defense of another person. They are separate laws.

In TX since you can lawfully carry a concealed handgun without a license inside of a vehicle, it is almost a moot point anyway. Having a CHL gives a person no more authority or justification to use defense.

The best case that I can think of is Bernhard Goetz in NY, later called the Subway Vigilante. Back in the mid-80's he claimed that he was being robbed by 5 and pulled an unlawfully possessed handgun under NY law. Goetz pulled his unlawfully possessed handgun and shot 4 of the 5. None died but I think one was injured seriously. He was subsequently charged with several first degree felonies and the firearms possession. A jury acquitted him of all the assaults but found him guilty of the handgun possession and he served less than a year in the county jail.

Just because he carried an illegal handgun, it did not take away his right to self defense even in NY.

Clear as mud?

[dustoffer]

Reason you don't want a CHL?

Not that I don't want it, just never felt the real need since I can carry at home and in my car w/o one. This situation makes me re-think however. I could'nt drive by and not help a LEO if I was able to help him.

[NewTexian]

You save a life, I bet no one will bat an eye.

[Tx_Wader]

If I remember right the man that killed the POS that shot Sammy Long was never identified by name to anyone outside of the Department. In fact my Dad told me that the Department did something for the man but I can't remember what it was. Edit: I was just reminded that He was given an engraved and gold plated 1911 for his actions by the Troopers Association.

So if you're armed don't hesitate to assist.


Patrolman
Sammy Charles Long
Texas Department of Public Safety - Texas Highway Patrol, Texas

End of Watch: Sunday, November 21, 1976

Patrolman Sammy Long was shot and killed after making a traffic stop on a driver for a traffic violation on US 67 near Rankin, Texas.

The suspect, who was AWOL from the US Navy, opened fire with a .32 caliber handgun as Patrolman Long approached the vehicle, knocking him to the ground. The suspect then took Patrolman Long's service weapon and shot him in the back six times as he lay on the ground.

A citizen, who was an avid deer hunter returning from a hunting trip, was stopped in a rest stop 150 yards from the traffic stop and witnessed the shooting. The man immediately retrieved his hunting rifle and shot the suspect at a range of 150 yards, killing him.

Patrolman Long had served with the Texas Highway Patrol for 18 years and was stationed at McCamey. He was survived by his wife and son.

Read more: http://www.odmp.org/officer/8242-pat...#ixzz3yb5J81sf

[Drycreek3189]

If I remember right the man that killed the POS that shot Sammy Long was never identified by name to anyone outside of the Department. In fact my Dad told me that the Department did something for the man but I can't remember what it was. Edit: I was just reminded that He was given an engraved and gold plated 1911 for his actions by the Troopers Association.

So if you're armed don't hesitate to assist.


Patrolman
Sammy Charles Long
Texas Department of Public Safety - Texas Highway Patrol, Texas

End of Watch: Sunday, November 21, 1976

I remember hearing about this on Paul Harvey's " The Rest of the Story " years ago. It was the first thing that came to mind when I read Dustoffer's post. The way I remember it, the man and his son were hunting, and the authorities would not even say which one shot the killer. My remember ain't what it used to be, so that may be wrong.

[Swampa]

Some people act/help-some stand on the sidelines. Different story but I found a girl dying from a brain injury on her driveway once. Held her and fought with her coming out of consciousness. A lot of neighbors stood there and watched. I was disgusted that no one would help me. I'm not ever gonna watch, repurcussions or not. That girl called me later and thanked me for saving her life. She was in therapy learning how to talk again. She was in her 30's.

[Playa]

Link to the original post?

[Mike D]

Not that I don't want it, just never felt the real need since I can carry at home and in my car w/o one. This situation makes me re-think however. I could'nt drive by and not help a LEO if I was able to help him.

Do you carry your car everywhere you go? Does you no good if you aren't in your car or home.

[texas assasin]

I don't have a CHL but almost always carry a pistol in the car. Would not hesitate to help specially an officer. That being said I had a dumbass gangster looking thug wave a gun at me once. We were driving and he was gonna change lanes didn't see me and I tapped the horn. I hardly ever honk at anybody! So, I catch a red light he pulls into shopping center starts waiving me down throwing gang signs he then goes in his car pulls a pistol and points to me. At that point I have pistol in hand no intention to fire unless he would have. This thugs don't know how to aim anyway. I wonder if I could've of just shot him????? My intentions were to pull into shopping center and whoop his #$% but after waiving pistol just not worth it. God bless all law enforcement