U.S. Debt question

[stickerpatch59]

Why don't we just give California to China and call that debt square...Let the rest of the folks we owe money to split up Nevada but they have to keep Harry Reid.

i like this idea, but sadly the chi-comms' would probably give reid back.

[Samson]

US citizens actually own 750 billion worth of Chinese bonds that they selectively defaulted on when the communists took over. They wont recognize the debt because they say that it was a previous administration's debt, therefore it was not their problem. I say after we have a regime change in 2 years we do the same thing!

http://americanbondholdersfoundation.com/

[Brooks]

check out the movie "End of the Road; How Money Became Worthless "

[Landrover]

Term limits, severe jail sentences for crooked politicians and just a little bit of historical perspective on financial issues goes a LONG dang way!

plus debt can only be paid down with excess cash. that's going to take cuts in government, stimulation of jobs/economy and unfortunately tax increases

bam, bingo, boom!!!

neither party will do anything about it because they are worried more about staying in office than they are at fixing things. Too many people are on the government tit now and nobody can get re-elected if they take it away.

Oh my lord.........thank goodness this thread was started! I have new found faith in TBHers. It is odd how few have chimed in..........guess it aint negative enough to garner comments!!! LMAO!

China is the largest foreign owner, but they don't own anywhere close to a majority of our debt. That's a very common misconception. It goes without saying that the US debt-to-GDP ratio is currently higher than it should be, but it is not higher than it has ever been right now. Back in the WWII years was when we had the highest debt-to-GDP ratios. We were over 100% back then. Last year it was at 71% - way too high still, but not as bad as WWII era. We're not past the "point of no return" today - yet. We definitely need to turn it around and get the debt load headed back down in the right direction, of course.

Shane in for the WIN!!!! This has made my day. It is amazing all the whining, crying, and moaning on TBH about everything social, racial or financial and most for some reason have very limited idea how the entire picture is being framed. Financially it is crappy........yes it is VERY crappy but the sky ain't falling at every dang turn of the radio dial or flip of the TV station.

[xman59]

Why don't we just give California to China and call that debt square...Let the rest of the folks we owe money to split up Nevada but they have to keep Harry Reid.

works for me, but it needs to be detached from the mainland first,, and fill the mote with sharks and piranhas ,

[GarGuy]

Term limits, severe jail sentences for crooked politicians and just a little bit of historical perspective on financial issues goes a LONG dang way!

bam, bingo, boom!!!

Oh my lord.........thank goodness this thread was started! I have new found faith in TBHers. It is odd how few have chimed in..........guess it aint negative enough to garner comments!!! LMAO!

Shane in for the WIN!!!! This has made my day. It is amazing all the whining, crying, and moaning on TBH about everything social, racial or financial and most for some reason have very limited idea how the entire picture is being framed. Financially it is crappy........yes it is VERY crappy but the sky ain't falling at every dang turn of the radio dial or flip of the TV station.

I agree. A decent leader in this country and we will boom like the 50s. Although... if the sky starts falling....it could fall really quick.

[Shane]

and this

plus debt can only be paid down with excess cash. that's going to take cuts in government, stimulation of jobs/economy and unfortunately tax increases

We need to increase tax revenues, but not tax rates. The best way for the government to collect more tax dollars is to reduce government regulation and burdensome tax rates and get out of the way so the private sector can thrive and grow. A bigger economy means more profits, higher wages, and more income for the government to tax. They would get more revenue from stable and/or lower tax rates on a growing economy than they would from higher tax rates on a stagnant economy.

[BrandonA]

Shane in for the win

[4wheels]

We are talking about the debt problem - it's just that the other problems are even louder. (Border, Russia, Israel, Syria, ebola, VA, Obama, Obama care.) We need to cut about 5 trillion in spending in both guns and butter. We need to build a way to either pay or put money in the bank so we don't borrow. Obama wanted to devalue the dollar in hopes to jump start manufacturing. Has not happened because the rest of the governments also devalued their currencies and now we are all racing to the bottom.

There are several things that will help us get out of debt.
1) More people working and paying taxes. Here is where the illegals and kids come in. By importing them from latin america - we are able to grow our population. The baby boomers are retiring now and their spending habits will change. So we need to figure out some way to get people off of government money and on to earning money and paying taxes.
2) Lower corporate taxes to employe more people here in America.
3) legalize drugs and end this drug war. Not because we approve of doing drugs - but we are tired of doing the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over again expecting a different result.
4) Tax #3.
5) Change leadership in America. As long as people get something / further an agenda by demonizing the 'rich' you won't create more rich people.

This can go on for a while. If we get too political - the admins will kill the thread. So don't think the folks on the GS don't know about this topic. They do and they are concerned about this for their family and country.

[txjustin]

John Maynard Keynes' theories of multipliers and big government spending being the "savior" of all make good theories, but they don't match up to reality. Even though his theories are proven wrong every time they're tried, big government politicians and liberal philosophers still love his work. Reason being that his ideas give them an excuse for the government to tax and spend and over-regulate and such.

Read Milton Friedman, Friedrich Hayek, and Thomas Sowell if you want to get a better idea of how things work best in the real world.

Here's a couple of entertaining videos that do a good job of illustrating the basic arguments between the free enterprise school of thought and the big government control camp. The more you learn about both schools of thought, the better these videos are. But they're still pretty good for anyone who hasn't read any of the super-thrilling economic theory stuff yet.

"Fear the Boom and Bust" a Hayek vs. Keynes Rap Anthem - YouTube

Fight of the Century: Keynes vs. Hayek Round Two - YouTube


As for US government debt.....

China is the largest foreign owner, but they don't own anywhere close to a majority of our debt. That's a very common misconception. Here's some good reading about the debt: http://useconomy.about.com/od/moneta...ional-Debt.htm

Also, if you only look at the total amount of US debt outstanding, that doesn't tell you everything you need to know. Comparing the outstanding debt today to the amount of debt outstanding at some point in the past doesn't tell you everything you need to know either. In order to get an idea of how big of a load the debt is for the nation you have to look at the debt compared to the size of the economy (the GDP - Gross Domestic Product). They call this the Debt-to-GDP ratio. It goes without saying that the US debt-to-GDP ratio is currently higher than it should be, but it is not higher than it has ever been right now. Back in the WWII years was when we had the highest debt-to-GDP ratios. We were over 100% back then. Last year it was at 71% - way too high still, but not as bad as WWII era. We're not past the "point of no return" today - yet. We definitely need to turn it around and get the debt load headed back down in the right direction, of course.

John Maynard Keynes would argue that government needs to borrow even more and "inject" that money into the economy in order to save the world. He was full of crap though.

THis is a man that knows what he's talking about. I'm a big fan of Hayek and Friedman.

[Landrover]

I agree. A decent leader in this country and we will boom like the 50s. Although... if the sky starts falling....it could fall really quick.

Great post! But don't forget if congress is doing their job (which is the peoples will) the so-called leader is nearly irrelevant in the big scheme. Congress having a lower approval rating than the president is downright shameful! Leadership is on rocky shores in every branch of this bloated government system over the last 25 years sadly!

[Mister Bubba's bulletman]

Why don't we just give California to China and call that debt square

Man I know you jest but suppose that actually happened. They're still a quasi communist fascist state with a billion people waiting to fly into LAX to populate a part of the world which to them looks vacant. We worry about Mexicans? Wow.

[super_dave]

U.S. Debt question

34% is owned by foreign nations-China being 8% of that

The federal government owns a lot also and social security funds

This^^^

Japan actually owns more than China, but most of the debt is actually owed to the social security account. It's been borrowed from since day 1.

The bad thing about the debt and what will eventually cripple our economy is not necessarily the "amount" of debt, but our credit rating as a nation. When it falls, we fall. HARD

[d arrow]

& more tax, & tax, tax. & more tax? I thought I pay enough tax? never mind.

[JBJTX81]

Read Forbes new book "Money". The crux of all of this and the solution to all of this is quit printing fiat money with a constantly fluctuating value. Our government started debasing our currency back in the 70's and doubled down on that policy during Bush 2. Commodities reflect the value of the $. How much is a 50lb bag of corn or gallon of gas or an ounce of gold vs 10-12 years ago.

He also did some really good interviews you can find on forbes.com a few months ago with some of the leading economists in the US. Bottom line is this..even with 18 trillion in debt the $ is still the safest investment in the world.

I don't like how things are run in Washington. I think we could do much better. BUT...I DO NOT fear some great fall. The world is trapped in the dollar. They have nowhere else to put their money and it will be impossible for the world to change that for a very very long time.