Indian artifact excavation

[GarGuy]

AMAZING amount of killer stuff. Were the Indians really that careless to leave so many good points and tools just laying around when they left camp, or do you think they periodically died out in that area or what?

They weren't careless at all. The high grade points were as good as cash. There were people on that site for over 12,000 years. That's a long time to loose points.

[Shane]

They weren't careless at all. The high grade points were as good as cash. There were people on that site for over 12,000 years. That's a long time to loose points.

Yeah, that's a LONG time. Thank goodness for the momentary lapses in organizational skills, huh?

[fo_teef]

In my lifetime, I reckon I've lost about 75 pocket knives...if they were made out of stone, there would be a lot of my "tools" around for future archaeologists to find!

[Shane]

In my lifetime, I reckon I've lost about 75 pocket knives...if they were made out of stone, there would be a lot of my "tools" around for future archaeologists to find!

I can't remember ever losing a knife that I didn't find again. But now that I mention it, I'll probably lose 3 tomorrow.

[Johnny]

Outstanding day for sure! Just a great mixture of points it looks like from middle archaic to paleo! Love that scotty..beautiful flaking on that sucker. Awesome points and thanks for the look!

On another note, is this site what you thought it would be...below your expectations or beyond your expectations?

[unclefish]

Awesome day!

Another question for you.

When they carbon date these things.....how do they distinguish the age of the rock itself (likely millions of years old) vs the knapped part which is obvious much younger?

[GarGuy]

Awesome day!

Another question for you.

When they carbon date these things.....how do they distinguish the age of the rock itself (likely millions of years old) vs the knapped part which is obvious much younger?

Great question.. You can only get an accurate date from the CHARCOAL in the habitation layer that contains the points. Good strata is critical for this and rarely occurs in East Tx. Point types dated in other areas are consistent in age across their range though as a rule.

[GarGuy]

Outstanding day for sure! Just a great mixture of points it looks like from middle archaic to paleo! Love that scotty..beautiful flaking on that sucker. Awesome points and thanks for the look!

On another note, is this site what you thought it would be...below your expectations or beyond your expectations?

Well....When I started this site, before we dug test holes, we thought it would be Archaic and 3ft deep just judging from the surface. It turned out to be much deeper and have a great Paleo layer. The "well" was totally unexpected and put the site over the top from a educational standpoint. The number of points is going to end up about what I expected I guess. Maybe 15,000 really good points in the main site and a BUNCH of brokes, pooters, and blades.

It hasn't turned out as many jaw droppers as expected but they may well still be coming. I have found brokes of every rare and exotic type I could ever have hoped for in this site. I guess if I could magically make the 20 best brokes reappear in their first stage, I would be a very wealth man. Just knowing there is potential for that kind of stuff gives me chills.

There are better sites out there and I hope to move on to another before very long. The site you are digging likely will turn out 25-30,000 points and all will be Paleo to early Archaic. You wont be digging through 10-14ft of dirt either so it will go much faster.

[GarGuy]

I can't remember ever losing a knife that I didn't find again. But now that I mention it, I'll probably lose 3 tomorrow.

Whats the total number of brodheads you have bought since you started bowhunting? Where are they now? Now picture bowhunting to feed your family and defend your village 365 days a year. How many would it be then?

[unclefish]

Great question.. You can only get an accurate date from the CHARCOAL in the habitation layer that contains the points. Good strata is critical for this and rarely occurs in East Tx. Point types dated in other areas are consistent in age across their range though as a rule.

Makes perfect sense now.....I couldn't figure out how they dated those things.

So correct me of I'm wrong but each culture basically made the same type/style of point for a period of time. Then that type would evolve or change into another type to take advantage of advancements in weaponry.....spear, atlatl, bow, etc...?

Or maybe another completely different culture would move in and have their own type of point the knapped?

I find this stuff completely fascinating.

[Shane]

Whats the total number of brodheads you have bought since you started bowhunting? Where are they now? Now picture bowhunting to feed your family and defend your village 365 days a year. How many would it be then?

Oh, I lose and/or break a lot of broadheads out in the field. I get that completely. I'm just amazed at how many of them are laying around in their camp area. I don't lose broadheads in camp. I doubt they just walked off and left them laying on the ground out of carelessness either. They spent a LOT of time making those suckers.

I can see them dropping a broken arrowhead on the ground and walking off. No way to glue them back together.

I just wonder what happened to end up with so many perfectly good arrowheads and tools just left in camp. It seems like their arrowheads and other tools would have been carefully packed up and taken with them whenever they were moving. But maybe every now and then some kind of catastrophe came along that required them to leave NOW, or maybe sometimes disease or a horrible weather event came along that killed them out or something. I'm sure that they dropped stuff in the grass and couldn't find it sometimes too.

Every time I see an arrowhead, it just makes me wonder about the guy that made it and used it, and I wonder about what was going on when the arrowhead landed on the ground right there.

[Johnny]

Great info on your site Steve. That's just a serious amount of artifacts that you have dug up on that place. You just never know what that next buckle load will bring to that sifter table. In other words, it seems this site has gone beyond your expectations...pretty neat stuff!!

I will respond to what you said about our site in my thread so not to bog down this one.

[Johnny]

Good discusson....the word 'camp' is just a generalization to describe a place where the natives lived. In reality, what we are calling camps are actually villages or even a city I guess you could say. The spot GarGuy is excavating is where they cooked, sat, made babies, made tools/arrowheads, slept, lived, dreamed, bathed, used the restroom and on and on and on. For the most part, they probably only left to hunt, fish or gather more material to make tools out of. From the looks of Garguy's site and sites that I have dug in, evidence clearly shows that they spent a serious amount of time chipping away making tools/arrowheads, possibly every day. Naturally the stuff they make stays within their village unless they are afield while hunting and they will take a few with them. Just my thoughts.

[Shane]

Naturally the stuff they make stays within their village unless they are afield while hunting and they will take a few with them. Just my thoughts.

I think so too, Johnny. I know some Indians moved around with the seasons and buffalo migrations and such. I don't know if the East Texas Indians moved as much as the plains Indians?? When they did move, do you think they took their arrows and tools with them, or did they leave them since packing up and hauling a bunch of rocks around would be heavy?

[Johnny]

I think so too, Johnny. I know some Indians moved around with the seasons and buffalo migrations and such. I don't know if the East Texas Indians moved as much as the plains Indians?? When they did move, do you think they took their arrows and tools with them, or did they leave them since packing up and hauling a bunch of rocks around would be heavy?

Strictly my opinion, but I don't think the Indians moved at all down in these parts. They had no reason to. They had natural springs for water at their feet, plenty of game and the winters were mild. I'm sure the summers were hot but nothing that a good shade tree and cool spring fed water to help them escape the heat. The evidence left behind (GarGuy's camp for example) clearly shows what I am thinking.